Maintaining High Standards

Buyer's Agent Matt sharp

Matt Sharp has had a passion for property for as long as he can remember.

When he turned 18, he set about saving for his first property and in the process started to learn everything he could about what drives property prices.

It took him six years to buy that first property, but since that point has gone on to build a substantial property portfolio and in the process has helped many people get started on their own property journey.

“Property is my passion and is something that I just love. I just enjoy all aspects, whether it be the data research, inspecting the property, or seeing how I could potentially develop or add value and then sharing that with other people.”

After finding a level of success personally, Matt wanted to expand what he was doing and felt that going down the path of becoming a buyer’s agent and helping and educating others was the right fit for him.

“The biggest thing for me early on what that, for every one positive story around property investing I heard, there were ten horror stories.”

“Not many people were having good experiences investing in property and unfortunately a couple of years ago there weren’t too many people out there giving good property investment advice.”

Matt is located on the Central Coast, an area that is doing exceptionally well at the moment and somewhere that he personally feels is a great place to be investing. His personal investment philosophy is a highly risk-averse one.

“In terms of the properties that we buy, I don’t buy anything brand new. Everything is existing, in areas that offer very low risk, low stock, low vacancy rates.”

“I’m a very, very low-risk investor personally and probably even more of a low-risk investor professionally when I’m advising people because obviously, I want to make sure that I’m eliminating every single pitfall possible.”.

While Matt had great success as an investor, getting his business up and running took time and plenty of perseverance.

“I’ve been operating for about 18 months now and to start with because I was on the Central Coast, the service wasn’t well known, so initially I just spent a lot of time just spreading the message that there was a buyer’s agent here on the central coast and sharing the message of what it was that I offered.”

“But getting clients just started from my inner circle or my established network of friends and other professionals or referral partners that I already had existing relationships with and those who sort of trusted me enough to refer some people to me and then obviously had some really good outcomes for people.”

“Then it just sorts of snowballed and snowballed from there. Now I get my clients from multiple referrals mainly because I’ve been fortunate enough to have some good outcomes and then people obviously trust you and then it just builds from there.”

Matt went through the BAI program and he feels it really helped him get where he wanted to go.

“Initially I didn’t really know how to get from A to Z. That’s what the BAI course does – it gives you a framework on how to run a successful buyer’s agency.”

“That help for me was tremendous and it just gave me the blueprint to be able to build my business and then how to run my business as well. So it taught me a lot.”

“I was never in real estate sales or anything like that, never wanted to be, never will be. I didn’t have a real estate background as such but leveraging my own personal experience and knowledge as well as the information that Ben shares in the BAI course combined, that can be quite powerful.”

“If you have your right morals and ethics and if you know your stuff, it can be very powerful.”

Going forward, Matt is looking to continue to grow his business while maintaining high standards.

“As clichéd as it sounds, I really want the buyer’s agent profession to have high standards and for people to look at us and our profession with a viewpoint that we add tremendous value and service because we all know what a real estate agent is and how people perceive them.”

“I really want to make sure that people look at my business in a completely different light.”

Matt suggests if you think a buyers agent sounds like the career for you, give it a go.

“There’s been a lot of late nights, there’s been a lot of early mornings, there’s been a lot of ups and downs, but for me personally it was probably the best thing that I did.”

“If you have a fire in the belly or if you have an itch that you feel as though you should be doing this, I would say give it a go because that’s what I did.”

Why Choose Impact Over Income?

Buyer's Agent Rasti Vaishav on why choose impact over income

Ben Handler:

Welcome to the Buyer’s Agent Institute Show. The purpose of the show is to bring awareness to buyer’s agents, to bring awareness around the career opportunities that the buyer’s agent sector is providing people. To bring awareness around the value that buyer’s agents providing people who need help buying property. Our goal with the show is to strip back, and dive into the remarkable stories, and journeys of buyer’s agents who are paving the way forward in one of the fastest growing career sectors in Australia right now.

Our guest today is Vaibhav Rastogi his nickname is Rasti. He’s a very rare individual, his roots take him back where he was born to India. And he had a very strong passion for property, which led him into architecture. And then due to family circumstances to better support his family, he then moved into IT. And then during his time and tenure in IT, he then moved to Singapore and did his masters in computer science.

Ben Handler:

And then after that, he wanted to challenge himself further and had a desire, a pursuit to get into the investment banking world, to work for one of the big banks. And then during that, he then went and did his MBA and then went and did his CFA, and then landed a job in one of the big banks and was responsible for managing over $2 billion worth of funds. And he was specializing in the research department. And during all this time, within seven years, he built his own investment portfolio up to a value of circa $5 billion, a positively geared portfolio with a very healthy debt to equity ratio.

Ben Handler:

Rasti’s had a very strong passion for property, which has led him now to leave the banking sector after building such a successful portfolio and start his new buyer’s agent business called Get Rare. It’s a very bespoke buyer’s agent business based in Melbourne. And what Rasti is doing with this particular business is he’s bringing his analytical skills, his research skills to the table to really analyze data and information, to make very sophisticated decisions for his clients. I’m super excited to introduce Rasti. Welcome Rasti.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Thank you so much, Ben really appreciate that. Yes, I’ve done it all and I love it. I love it. And to me it’s all about purpose. We talk about property investing as just about properties, to me it’s much more than that. It’s about fulfilling your dreams. I’ve actually taken more of a consultation approach, understanding what people are after, like what are their desires, what are their wants? And then having an understanding of where they want to be and where they are today. And then bridging the gap through the investing in properties is just one way, which are filled. The whole scenario, whole working around coming from as you had mentioned, I’m coming from a very humble background from India, where I’ve realized that it’s all about education, understanding of how people are doing it and then just emulating them.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

It’s a very easy formula, which I’ve actually done quite a few times now moving to IT industry, learning from the best, then moving into the financial sector again, going to do my MBA like went to AGSM, and even to US, one of the best schools over there Booth Business School. And now coming to you, Ben in all honesty, like you are one of the best or rather you are the best actually I should say. And to me it’s more about learning from the best in the breed. And thank you so much for all the support and the coaching.

Ben Handler:

You’ve got a very impressive background by the way. Your resume, I mean. I’m inspired by what… But anytime I see someone who’s put in effort and who’s learned something, whatever it is, I’m always inspired. And I admire that. And when you sent me your bio and I was looking forward to obviously meeting you today. Because I know you’ve come here from Melbourne, but I was reading it and I was thinking, wow, I mean, you’ve done a lot. And what really struck a chord with me was you started in architecture.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Yes.

Ben Handler:

And obviously that was your purpose. You were in the property arena there. Then you got distracted like I did as well, and like some other people do, which is not a bad thing. I don’t mean that in a bad way. And now you’re back in the property space, doing what you love, how does that feel?

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

It is just amazing, like I remember one of the speeches by Steve Jobs in one of the university, like on the graduation day and he was talking to the students and he said something which actually resonated very well with me is like whatever we do in our college days, or whatever we do in our career, they are just the stepping stones. It will take a while for us to figure out how those dots actually connect. When I was doing architecture, I was very passionate. I was actually doing some projects as well. I was actually [inaudible 00:04:55] in my university as well as I got scholarship, but it was just I guess the demand of the time then that I had to support my family. Back home or back in India. It’s like, you have to work very hard yards.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

I’m happy to go hard yards. But then it takes a while for an architect to slog through to make a substantial living out of it. For me, it was more about the need of the time to support my family. And for that reason, I had that passion to learn and quickly deliver. And that’s the reason why I actually started in computer science. I actually learned programming on my own and I got a job while I was actually studying my architecture as well, so I had a job offer in my pocket as an IT consultant before I actually finished my architecture degree. It was not really a brainer for me to switch it very quickly from there. People were arguing like how come five years of degree, which is pretty good time for me to establish over there and let it just go. Looking back what I’ve actually learned in architecture is that we started the design.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

We started the concept. We don’t really just come up and start doing the fine details of where the wiring or where the toilet should look like. We actually start with a concept like, okay, this is the building. This is what we are thinking about. This is the form. This is the artistic part of it, and the function, and the engineering aspect of it. Like how it combines together to generate something tangible.

Ben Handler:

Yes.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Now, fast forward a couple of decades now. This is what I’m actually doing. Like irrespective of whether the property is related to the architecture, but I’m thinking about designing the life, designing the right way of approaching it. And then coming up with the conforming components, that how we should do one thing at a time.

Ben Handler:

I noticed the path of the architecture, and then now buyer’s agent. And obviously the pieces have come together, but I want to talk about designing the life because that’s what you just mentioned there.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Yes.

Ben Handler:

When you were in banking and IT, you’re working from obviously great companies. Did you see that as really designing a life compared to now running your own business?

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Yup.

Ben Handler:

What’s your definition now of designing your own life?

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Before I answer that, if I talk about how do I see that happening in my IT job or in my finance job, it’s more about what is the goal that we’re trying to achieve? Like when we talk about the IT project, there are so many components as a project manager, that one has to look after stakeholders, budget, timeline, constraints, the challenges which keep coming and all of a sudden, all you have an eye on is, okay, this is what we really want to achieve. Now you just go work backwards that these are the conforming components, right? Now coming back to the life question, maybe if you allow me, I really want to relate a story.

Ben Handler:

Sure.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Because that has actually got me going, my mother has been a very hard working mother as a lady. She started a business just to support us to get into the right education system. And what I’ve learned from a story that she told early on in my childhood was that there was a baby elephant tied to a tree. The rope that actually tied it was very thin, but it was strong enough for the baby elephant to be tied to the tree, so the baby elephant tried to break it many times one week, two weeks, four weeks, and then he forgot about it. Fast forward a few years that same elephant is now an adult elephant still tied to the same thin tree via thin rope. The idea is that actually it’s not really a story of an elephant. The story of our common nine to five, like the thing that you’re t-shirt talks about.

Ben Handler:

[between the night 00:08:39].

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Yes. It’s us in general, because when we grew up, we had lots of passions and lots of thinking that we really want to do, what were our desires, but the challenges of the life got us… We always talk about time, money, and energy, it’s a fine balance of the three. In our life stages we have at most two out of three, when we are young, we have time, we have energy but no money, right. In our adulthood, we have lots of money, we have lots of energy, somehow no time. In our later stages of life, we have time and money, but no energy, right. If think through this, we are not really leading the life you want to, but rather just cycling through.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

What I’d really talk about is like, okay, what are your desires? Like if there’s no constraint of time and money, what will you do today? Will it be a job, nine to five job you are doing? I mean, there’s nothing wrong… People are passionate about jobs. I have been very passionate about when I was an architect, I was enjoying it. When I was in IT, I was enjoying that. I enjoyed it, but I’m not really forced to do that, or am actually choosing to do that.

Ben Handler:

It seems like a lot of the people who are in those nine to five, I’m sure some of them would love what they’re doing and add a lot of value, but it seems like they’re the elephant. That sometimes they’re not pursuing their true talents and skills, that they’re put on this planet really to do. And they’re just a slave to the job.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

I would think so, but at the same time, the conversation that I used to have with these people, because they don’t really have a choice, they have to like the job they’re doing.

Ben Handler:

Yes.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

I mean, the way I said either you love what you do, or rather I should say and do what you love.

Ben Handler:

Why did you decide? You were obviously very good at what you did. You’ve had very good roles. You got into your dream job in banking.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Yes.

Ben Handler:

And you obviously did a MBA and a CFA on your way there. You’re obviously very committed, but now you’ve pivoted.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Yes.

Ben Handler:

Why did you pivot?

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

It goes back to my story, personal story. When I saw my parents working very hard, they actually struggled to put food on the table for us. Like education was the key. For someone like my family from a middle class family education is the only way. It was down to the concept that how we can change it. And for me the motivation was to make money work harder for you, but then also the need for that kind of a community to do it, is at the ground level, the common man. When I was managing a portfolio of $2 billion, I was enjoying it, it was my dream role. I was loving it, it was my desired role. I did hard yards to get into that role, like MBA and CFA, amidst GFC, it was not easy to make a switch. I was probably one of the only ones among three cohorts to make it a switch in that time.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

But I did it, I was committed. I was enjoying it, but only I realized that I’m actually making rich person richer. It was not congruent to my value system. My value system was to help the common man live their life, step up, and do what they really want. I have to take a step back and I think it was also circumstantial that my property investing was very successful. I probably stuck the winning formula on how to find the properties. And also by the way, there was a lot of research behind it, like systematically, which came from my way of investing in finance portfolios, and also the knowledge of the architecture, like how the property attributes work and not. At the end of the day it’s not about property, it’s about the people. The winning formula that I have, I actually build that portfolio in seven years. I did hard yards, almost on every weekend I was visiting along with my young ones in the back of the car, visiting those properties, doing inspections with me.

Ben Handler:

Did you hire a buyer’s agent during that time?

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Actually I did. I did one of them. The experience was probably a bit subpar and I certainly see a big, big need that’s why I can do a better job, let me put it this way.

Ben Handler:

Was that a tipping point? Was that a point of awareness where you thought maybe I should become a buyer’s agent?

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Not really because my… Okay. I actually went to Tony Robbins show last year, Unleash your Power Within, UPW they call it. Amazing, amazing value. I would say everyone should go. A $1000, if you’re running short of it, I’m happy to donate from my side. It’s amazing code because I know you will support it further down, other people. It just wakes the power within us, unleashes it. And that made me realize that, okay, this was my awakening then at that point of time. Like, what is my purpose? Like if when I die, on my death bed, what people would be talking about? What would be my obituary looking like? And then I realized that yes, I’m making money for the high net worth individuals. Yes I might get a thing, that okay I was getting paid for that job, but working with moms and dads is an entirely different experience. The sense of fulfillment of finding them their dream home, because it’s just not about investment properties that I look at.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

I’m also looking with the same rigor of systematic approach to buying a home. That’s pretty unique in the way I look at it, because my value proposition is I bring the same rigor of IT systems of managing portfolios. Like I was once part of a $7 billion Australian equity portfolio, which was based on systematic investing. We found the attributes, what are favorable attributes and what are not, and how the share price movement is based on that, actually. I use the same systematic approach, which I call it as a [factor rate model 00:14:39] . Everyone when they are looking for a home has different definition of the ideal home.

Ben Handler:

Yes.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Coming from the consultation background, it’s like, okay, what do you like? What are the aspects that you really want to desire in your property?

Ben Handler:

I feel like the architecture, you’re starting with this concept. And then you’re moving into the detail.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Exactly right.

Ben Handler:

I wanted to… There’s so much to talk about. And you’ve got such an incredible story. Now you really do. And I see your value… Talking about value proposition. I mean, it’s very compelling. It’s compelling for many levels. I mean, obviously from risk analysis, from what you’ve done yourself in seven years, building the portfolio you have. It’s impressive on many levels. And I don’t think you’re going to be short of any clients by the way. We can maybe talk about how the journey has been. I think more importantly from what I’m hearing today and what I’m experiencing with you right now is there’s so much purpose with what you’re doing. You came from humble beginnings, you got out of architecture to move careers in a different sector to better support your family, right? That’s powerful.

Ben Handler:

And then you went on this awesome adventure, achieved everything. And then you’ve decided to, as you said, take a step back. There was an awakening moment at UPW, and you’ve actually gone back now to serve. Like actually serve in a very purposeful way. I think that must feel amazing for you waking up every day now going, I’m actually helping people with this knowledge that I’ve cultivated, I’ve done myself, I’ve developed it in so many different areas, and I’m packaging it up now with my own mix.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Yes.

Ben Handler:

My own ingredients. And I’m going to help you get money working for you.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Yes.

Ben Handler:

That’s powerful.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

It is certainly powerful. And Ben, I can’t thank you enough for me to get into this journey as well, get that network. But yes it’s very, very fulfilling, very fulfilling because when I buy a property as an investment property for the client, like property unseen for them. And they trust in me as an individual and also in our processes and in my success, which they can really see. They have all this… Because I’ve been hardworking, there’s no success without… Like no pain, no gain. Yes, on the top you can see that I have been successful in three different careers. There has been a lot of hard work, a lot of support, a lot of sacrifices made through the way. To me it’s the why, why as in the purpose. If you’re clear on your purpose, it’s not what you have covered so far it’s more about where you want to go.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

And looking at that flag and then how closely you are approaching or how quickly you want to approach. And I’ve been one of those impatient person, but at the same time being strategic, I’ve never rushed into things. I’d rather do the thing the right way and only the right way. What’s more fulfilling for me is to make people realize that they have a story behind themselves. Every individual is individual as in like they have their own personal story. And part of them really want to do a lot more. Just like relating back to the elephant, they really want to go and break the shackles, break the status quo and live the free world.

Ben Handler:

Let’s quickly talk about, Get Rare.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Yes.

Ben Handler:

It’s your new company, you’re the founder, you’re the director, you’re the buyer’s agent. I’m sure you’re in that startup you’re running, you’re the marketer, you’re the finance man, you’re the IT person, you’re doing everything, I’m sure.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Yes.

Ben Handler:

Like we all do when we start our businesses, which is exciting. But then we work out which hat are we going to now give up, give to someone else. But let’s talk about that because I’d be curious to know what is the ideal style of client that you’d love to work with?

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

The way I look at it, as someone who is open to the ideas, like I’ve actually come across many people, but they have their own way of thinking and they get stuck.

Ben Handler:

They get quite fixated.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

They are very fixated. They’re not flexible at all. For my recent client, I saved him 80 grand. If I’m charging 15 grand is probably not really a brainer. Like I’m going to saving them money, saving them time, saving them the stress.

Ben Handler:

That’s a big one.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Yes. Yeah. I’m actually proud of what I actually found. But what I’m trying to say is that the message has to go across to quite a few people out there. For me, the ideal personality client would be someone who’s ready to hear the ideas, ready with the concept of not just financial leverage, but the knowledge leverage. They don’t have to make the mistake on their own. They don’t really have to get frustrated. They can outsource the whole process. And to me it’s an arm’s length that I would just go and find a property for them. My approach is very consultative. Like I would be as if holding their hands and talking through them like what they want or what they should be looking at. My purpose is to educate them, empower them. I’m not really saying buy your first property through me, and buy the second, and the third, and the fourth with me as well.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Of course, if I give them the lot of value in the first one, along with the knowledge and the confidence, I know they will come back to me. My business model is give them all that I can give in terms of knowledge skills, plus my time and more important than that the attention. Quite a few people like I’ve got few clients already that I’m working with. And they have got a lot in my pipeline. And the basis of which has been that I have been very generous with my time, sharing my knowledge, because my purpose is not to just acquire clients. My purpose is to help them. Because I had been on that side before I know the pain of not really finding the right platform to grow from.

Ben Handler:

I guess, in finishing up today, your name in Sanskrit is prosperity. That’s right. So I think for anyone who’s coming into your inner circle, into your, into your orbit and with what you’ve achieved yourself, just with own portfolio and just with your career and the commitment and the dedication and the focus that you’ve put in, everything that you’ve done, even the tennis right. Prosperity I feel is going to manifest. And where can people find you

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Show? So I’m very much on the social media. So I got a website dot com.edu. I got an Instagram handle. I’m very much on LinkedIn as well. So Facebook, LinkedIn, Instagram, but yeah, the website for the first way, the main contact point.

Ben Handler:

Yeah. As we finished up, when I saw your website and I saw your emails come through in the blogs. And this dude is, he’s savvy with IT, it looks slick, it looks good, so well done. I’ve really enjoyed our chat. I’m super pumped to see where you go. I think not just for you, but for your clients. I think it’s exciting to see where you go. I know that we will stay connected and I’m going to watch you and hopefully I’ll get you on again soon just to hear version two.

Vaibhav “Rasti” Rastogi:

Sure.

Ben Handler:

But I appreciate your time. It’s been awesome. Hope you enjoyed the chat. That was super awesome. I made a mistake at the beginning. Rasti is actually based in Sydney. I’m sure he buys nationally, so you can give him a call, check out his website.

Ben Handler:

You’ll learn more about his investment strategy, his philosophy and what he does. He is Sydney based. His story’s incredible, right? Starting in architecture, moving into IT, then moving into financial services, where he specializes at a bank working in research, managing 2 billions worth of funds. You can understand and appreciate his level of data analysis and looking at information and making very smart decisions, right. And he’s also built as you’ve heard, he’s own very successful portfolio in only seven years. Speak to Rasti, his investment strategies, his dedication to his clients is really first class. Check him out, see you next week.

Please watch the full episode here:

From Funds Manager to Property Expert

Over the span of his working life, Vaibhav Rastogi, also referred to as ‘Rasti’, has learnt how to manage money and investments in both property and financial markets.

With a degree in Architecture and an MBA in Finance, behind him, Vaibhav after working in IT embarked on a career in Funds Management, where he managed over $2 billion of client funds. However, he realised that his passion was best served in helping individuals achieve wealth, rather than those that already have money.

As a successful property investor himself, he felt that helping people achieve success in property by becoming a buyers agent was the right fit for him.

“Eventually, I realised that my value system is more congruent to helping people on the ground level as compared to multiplying money for those who already have it.”

“Property investing is one of the most common, most trusted way of building wealth as we have seen throughout humankind, but at the same time, not everyone makes property investment a success. Property investing is simple but successful property investing is not that simple.”

“That’s where I started using my architecture skills of evaluating a property and its design, investing as a vehicle and understanding it’s not just about capital growth and cash flow, but also about the risk that people tend to overlook in all the excitement.”

Vaibhav had built a personal property portfolio of 15 properties, and his goal is to help others achieve the same or better level of success.

“When I looked back, I realised that I started my property investing journey when I didn’t have much in my pocket, and now, I’m sitting on decent equity – this is exactly what I want to do for my prospective clients.”

“I had been unofficially helping my friends and family, but the whole reason that I wanted to start a business around it is so that I could reach out and help other people beyond my social circle.”

Given his success as an investor, Vaibhav already had a network of people around him that were interested in using his services as a buyer’s agent, which made the transition easier for him.

“Lots of people around me were actually waiting for me to start a business so they could approach me, so the pipeline was already there.”

“The business is going great so far. I run workshops on a monthly basis, where I outline my portfolio approach, referred to as Get Rare Model, and how I built my own portfolio without taking too much risk.”

“Calling myself a professional buyer’s agent has also given me a lot of leverage when I talk to the selling agents as well because they know that I’m actually representing not just only one client, but maybe a handful of clients in one go. Apparently helping me establish the relationship rather one considered as a transaction.”

Despite having a solid background as a successful property investor, Vaibhav decided to reach out to the BAI to gain a better understanding of running the business side of a buyer’s agency as well as to see how others built their businesses.

“Ben and his team at BAI do an amazing job as for me, coming from the corporate world where it was all about teamwork and working together, when I started on my own I realised that I’m all by myself.”

“BAI with their guidance, coaching and mentorship, has given us a network of other fellow buyer’s agents and it’s easy to visualise what a business can potentially look like in, twelve months or even five years.”

Vaibhav’s main focus is working with property investors and given his background and personal success, that was always going to be a good fit. One of the core components of Vaibhav’s methodology is centred around managing risk across an entire property portfolio. In much the same way a share investor looks to diversify, Vaibhav believes having a portfolio approach to both risk and growth is vital. Having worked in research advisory for Financial Planners, he appreciates how essential it is to get the solution client-centric and holistic.

For those people looking to start a career as a buyer’s agent, he feels that passion for property is vital.

“It is such a big responsibility and one has to take it very seriously because clients are giving you the responsibility of buying their property, which is one of the biggest investments they are ever going to make.”

“Buyers Agents also have to have a passion for the people because it’s just not about the properties, but also about the people.“

Lessons from a Billionaire

Buyer's Agent Daniel Trelease on lessons from a Billionaire

Ben Handler:

Welcome to the Buyer’s Agent Institute Show. The purpose of the show is to bring awareness to buyer’s agents, to bring awareness around the career opportunities that the buyer’s agent sector is providing people. To bring awareness around the value that buyer’s agents providing people who need help buying property. Our goal with the show is to strip back, and dive into the remarkable stories, and journeys of buyer’s agents who are paving the way forward in one of the fastest growing career sectors in Australia right now.

Ben Handler:

Our guest today is Daniel Trelease, he is the founder, and CEO of Trelease Associates, the headquarters is based in Sydney, in Double Bay. Daniel prides himself on two key things, number one, customer service, and number two, developing an extraordinary, and exceptional company culture.

Ben Handler:

Daniel’s career is quite remarkable, it’s also very unique where it started. He was headhunted by the former entertainment media billionaire mogul, Robert Stigwood. Robert Stigwood had a country estate in England, and Daniel managed this estate, and looked after, not just property, but art, but also diversified in understanding different business ventures.

Ben Handler:

Daniel was also engaged by high net worth individuals to buy property, and art across New York, and London. Daniel has been in Australia for less than a decade, and brings a very unique energy into his new business. So, I’m very excited to introduce Daniel Trelease today. Welcome Daniel.

Daniel Trelease:

Thank you very much. Thank you for having me.

Ben Handler:

I’ve always been meaning to ask about this whole Robert Stigwood. He’s obviously a billionaire, he was from Australia, he moved to England. I believe he was the first billionaire in the world.

Daniel Trelease:

I don’t know if he was the first, he was certainly one of the first, and I believe he was one of the first, certainly in Australia. But, he was actually born in Adelaide as well, where I was born. And, that’s I believe certainly, after he passed I started thinking about why me, and I think it was, “I’m going to give this young kid from Adelaide a chance.” And, I’ll be forever grateful for that, because that was the start of my journey.

Ben Handler:

But, how did it all come together?

Daniel Trelease:

I was actually working in the executive club lounge at a hotel, the Hyatt Regency at the time, I think it’s the InterContinental now in Adelaide. And, he said to me, “You don’t seem nervous at all.” And, my boss was there holding the silver tray, shaking like this. And, I said, “I don’t know who you are.” And, he just sort of smiled, and said, “That’s great, no worries.”

Daniel Trelease:

And, I went on with my day, and the next time I had to serve him, eventually the president of his companies at the time said to me, “You’d be really good working with us.” And, it just went from there, then they took me to dinner, and discussed the opportunity. I went, and visited the estate, and Robert, and his team in the Isle of Wight at the time in England, and came back made decision, finished my degree, and went to work for them.

Ben Handler:

When I introduced, and said, “Managed the country estate state,” I mean, a lot of people listening to this won’t probably quite grasp what that really means. Do you mind maybe sharing around the size, the number of staff? I mean, you were managing something very large.

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah, I was effectively what they would call a majordomo, which was the head of the household. So, I would manage all of the staff from the nurses, the security, the chefs, the gardeners, then all of his executive team as well, and everyone in between. Hiring, firing, training, and being the conduit between Robert, and a staff member effectively.

Ben Handler:

How many staff members roughly?

Daniel Trelease:

Just on the estate at any given time between 30, and 40.

Ben Handler:

Wow, amazing. So, what did you learn? I mean, obviously that’s a very unique experience for someone to go through, and be part of that whole journey. What is it that you learned? What was the key thing?

Daniel Trelease:

I think that’s probably where I developed most of my people skills. I was exposed to people that I don’t ever read about, or seen on television. He’s obviously, he was the godfather to a number of the Royal Family’s children, that sort of thing he often visited.

Daniel Trelease:

He’s also the man who created Grease, Saturday Night Fever, Cream, Evita, merge companies, Brian Epstein, run the Beatles for a while, et cetera. And, I actually flew to Melbourne at one point to hire the new gentlemen to take over Saturday Night Fever in the West End, and being thrown in the deep end like that with people that I couldn’t even possibly fathom.

Daniel Trelease:

There was actually one point when I hung up the phone on John Travolta by accident. I was just transferring it to Robert’s quarters, and it just cut out, and I was like sugar. So, anyway I got in a lot of trouble for that. But, Look he called back, and he was fine. The lesson I did learn though, is that with that level of power, and wealth does not always come humility, and decency. And, I know that he had a reputation for being an extraordinarily hard person.

Daniel Trelease:

I mean, everyone knows it’s common knowledge he was hung off of his balcony by the Kray twins, which were mafia, because he was monopolizing the industry. And, I remember one point he called me, I was not in working hours, and I was asked to come up to the main house. I had a house on the estate, and I was asked to come up, and he asked me to come up, which was a 15 minute journey from my house to his, kind of thing. Out of hours, on my very few hours off, to pick a pen up next to his bed, and give it to him when there was 20 staff in the house. To show me that’s your place, don’t ever forget it, kind of thing.

Daniel Trelease:

And, I’ll never forget that moment ever, but I’ll also never forget the moments where he enjoyed glass of champagne, and telling me extraordinary stories, which have enriched my life forever. And, I tell them over, and over are.

Ben Handler:

Can you share any of them?

Daniel Trelease:

They’re probably, a lot of them are rather inappropriate, as you can imagine being a billionaire in the sixties, and seventies, that sort of thing, the sorts of things that went on, but they were very entertaining.

Ben Handler:

Let’s talk about Trelease Associates, because what I love so much about the buyer’s agent sector is they’re so many up, and coming new businesses with people like you have extraordinary skill, and talent. That you’ve then transferred now into this space. And, what you’re doing with Trelease Associates is very unique. I’ve obviously been in the space a long time, and I don’t see really anyone out there in Australia doing what you’re doing. So, what’s the purpose behind what you’re doing? And, what are you looking to do?

Daniel Trelease:

I suppose, from my experience with people mostly, I wanted to create something which wasn’t mine, which wasn’t about me. It wasn’t about feeding me, it wasn’t about growing just me. It was about who can I bring into this company to grow with me for the entire journey. And, I’m not just talking about staff retention. I created Trelease Associates, because I’m the sole owner right now, but it’s created, so then there’s people like, and he most certainly will be Jeremy Bedwani, who I believe is just as important to the success of this company as myself.

Daniel Trelease:

And, I don’t believe it could be what it is even today, 14 months on without him as an example, and other heads of divisions too. So, Trelease Associates was created, so there’ll be associates. There will be obviously myself as the founder, but in time there will be stakeholders like Jeremy, and others in the future as well. So, they own a piece of this company, a significant piece, and it’s not bought, it’s gifted to them.

Daniel Trelease:

It’s about creating a culture where we’re all building a family, a business that can become nationwide, possibly larger, but that’s not the goal. Where we’re working towards a common goal, and every single day I can honestly tell you, we joke, we laugh, we have an amazing time. And, yes there’s difficult times too, and we expect that, and we learn from that, we pivot like we have during COVID.

Ben Handler:

Yeah, and it’s apparent from the outside looking in around what you’re doing. It’s very different, and it seems, as I said earlier, very unique. Let’s talk about the confidentiality part.

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah.

Ben Handler:

That’s something that no one’s doing. Most people in the buyer’s agent space, social media, advertising, it’s all about just bought. You’ve taken a very different approach, do you mind sharing why, and what you’re doing?

Daniel Trelease:

I believe that we’re in customer service, and customer service after spending well over a decade in London, New York, I even lived in Greece for six months. I just feel that it’s missing from the fabric of our society here in Australia. You go to a restaurant, that’s not service. It’s appalling in my eyes. I wanted to create something where the confidentiality piece, we didn’t leverage on our client, and what we bought for them to self promote. We were engaged by our client to source, and to secure a property for them, whether it be investment, whether it be primary residence.

Daniel Trelease:

Not then to plaster that over social media, or to leak it to the media, that sort of thing. It’s about discretion, it’s about a different level of service that Australians perhaps are not entirely used to. That would be expected in say London, and confidentiality is not necessary for all of our clients. Not at all. Most in fact, do not require it, but it is absolutely there for the clients who do.

Daniel Trelease:

It doesn’t just revolve around the confidentiality upon exchange. For example, where the client’s identity is held confidentially with a confidentiality deed signed by the sales agent, the sales agency principal, myself as the principal of Trelease Associates, the buyer’s agent that may have been acting for that buyer, our buyer, and the vendor. All signed, so it’s basically just an extra signature before they sign the contract.

Ben Handler:

Every transaction?

Daniel Trelease:

Not every transaction for the clients that require this. Every client can have it if they wish. Some clients don’t wish for it, they just don’t care, it’s not necessary. Absolutely fine. But, it’s more about what about their buying power? Because, their buying power is usually exposed to most sales agents, because I’ve been looking for one, two, three, six, 12 months before engaging buyer’s agent. Therefore, it’s about confidentiality around the client themselves during the process.

Daniel Trelease:

So, some of these clients, we had one recently that had full confidentiality. No one knows what we bought, no one knows how much we bought it for, and no one is allowed to disclose. That client was even searching at the time. So, that client’s buying power was also confidential. Therefore, because the agents understood where their budget may have been, they needed to know this, they were just working with client five at Trelease Associates.

Ben Handler:

Yeah, it’s extraordinary. And, let’s talk about leadership obviously, and actually before we dive into leadership, I would think that when I opened up, I talked about one of your principles is customer service. It seems like it’s clear, it runs through the DNA of your entire company. Has that been inherited from Robert Stigwood?

Daniel Trelease:

Absolutely.

Ben Handler:

Yeah.

Daniel Trelease:

Unequivocally. I mean, even from my hospitality days, I mean, I remember when my parents didn’t want me to go to acting school, and that sort of thing, which was my passion as a young man. They wanted me to finish my degree, and that sort of thing as I did. But, during that I was working from 16, 15, whatever it was onwards. And, I ended up in silver service in a five star hotel in Adelaide. Therefore, I was poached from Robert, and moved to England.

Daniel Trelease:

And, naturally when you’re serving people from the Royal Family, you’re serving Robert himself, it’s all silver service. And it is the hand behind the back. You’re pretty much leaving the room, walking backwards, that kind of thing. It was very intense. It’s a level of service that almost is nonexistent today, but I revere it.

Ben Handler:

Wow, so you, from being exposed to that, you’ve been able to now transfer just that high quality, because you’re right Australia, it’s poor service.

Daniel Trelease:

Very.

Ben Handler:

And, especially when you go to the States, and come back, you just notice that distinction. So, obviously working at the estate in the UK, you were managing, you were hiring, you were firing, you were strategizing, you were organizing, coordinating, you are a leader. I think we’re all leaders in our own right. Now, you’re running your new company. You’ve got people in various divisions in different States. Has your understanding of leadership changed at all?

Daniel Trelease:

Every day, every single day. Every day I’m learning, even Jeremy, and I learned from each other every day. And, we strategize together every day. But, even after Robert when I worked for TDA Interiors, for example, under Richard Taylor, the founder of TDA Interiors were still operational in South of England, and in central London too. And, watching those different leadership styles from Robert, which is an extraordinary style, I suppose, all the way through to Richard, which was very commercial.

Daniel Trelease:

And, I look at myself as a highly emotional being, hight EQ. Jeremy, high IQ, and very commercial. So, the ying and yang work exceptionally well. We couldn’t be more different in our leadership styles, and that’s probably why we work so well together to create a company that is, I certainly hope I’m right in saying this, not only humble, and not only caring, and compassionate, but we genuinely love, and care for the people inside those walls. And, we will protect them, and nurture them and help them grow, and that’s one of Jeremy’s primary role.

Daniel Trelease:

So, the leadership isn’t just for me, it is across the team. We’ve got Kim Ackerman who’s basically writing the Trelease Associates handbook, for example. On her own accord she came to us. I believe that leadership needs to go across the spectrum of the company, and not just dripped down from the top. I don’t believe in the hierarchy, and the older models. Could be wrong, but at the moment it seems to be doing very well. And, the company as a whole, and the staff are enjoying this leadership style.

Ben Handler:

I agree, the leadership always should really move from the bottom up. And, the fact you’ve got this lady in your office who’s put her hand up to say-

Daniel Trelease:

Absolutely.

Ben Handler:

…I want to take lead with this, is a clear, I guess, indication, and reflection demonstration of what’s really going on in the company. Because, it seems not just customer service is something that runs throughout your entire company, it’s something that obviously you pride so much.

Ben Handler:

Because, I remember back at the Cohen Handler days, you were always having dinner at 10:00 at night at a restaurant with the 65 year old client. And, it seems like you were just forging these very close friendships. So, outside of a transaction your client relationships now becoming friendships, right?

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah, look, there’s three, four clients that have had babies during, or after being a client of mine, and I’ve been in the hospital before they’ve even gotten home with their baby. And, I’ve got 60, 70, 80 plus year old clients who I still take to dinner, because they’re alone, and I truly enjoy their company. I’m an old soul, a lot will say I’m like an eight year old Jewish man, and that’s the joke in the office.

Daniel Trelease:

I suppose I do definitely connect to older people far more than younger. I love being around the youth, and the energy like Jack Henderson in our office, fantastic. He always prides himself, he was a minor, he didn’t finish school, and look at him now.

Ben Handler:

The Flamingo.

Daniel Trelease:

Yes, the Flamingo, right. And, then we’ve got lawyers, and we’ve got forensic accountants, and all sorts of people as well in the company. So, education as well I don’t believe is a factor. You cannot train passion, you cannot train hustle, you can only train skill. And, that’s the biggest lesson that we’ve learned over the last six to 12 months is that don’t just hire someone that’s been in real estate, and need to unravel bad habits, for example. Hire someone who has the passion, hire someone who has the hustle ingrained in them, that is innate in them. Then, and only then let’s train those people.

Ben Handler:

I love it. What do you love about real estate?

Daniel Trelease:

I have to say it’s not even the real estate. It’s the people, because every day I meet someone new, a different character, whether it be a flamingo or something else brought into our life to enrich our lives. And, we’ve got incredibly diverse team of people, and we’re hiring at the moment. So, there’s more people that are coming on board. Some of them are quite characters as well, but you know what, everyone who sits in front of us in the boardroom is different too.

Daniel Trelease:

Some are going to suit my demeanor, and my character. Some are going to suit Jack’s or Kim’s or Annabelle’s or whoever’s. And, that’s why also we need to figure out who aren’t we servicing, who aren’t we helping, and how can we help them. So, we’re looking at a commercial division that has never been done before. We have tried, it didn’t pan out the way Jeremy, and I had wanted it to, and that’s fine.

Daniel Trelease:

We live, and we learn, we pivot, and we evolve. And, now we’re looking at someone who, whether this person comes to fruition or not, this is someone who is at very high level, and was head of acquisitions for a very well known firm. And, we’re looking at bringing them on, so we can service the commercial clients, and buyers out there.

Daniel Trelease:

We’re looking at the property management division that we’re building very assertively, and right now we’re only six months away from launching Brisbane. Less than 12 months away from launching Mosman. And, it’s about not expanding too quickly, not trying to take over any kind of world domination, as they say, it’s about who can we service, and service well.

Daniel Trelease:

And, you know what? Sometimes we’ll fail, so we’ll pivot, we’ll try again, or we’ll move on, and we want to figure out what we’re great at. And, that’s been my biggest lesson, what I’m great at, and what I’m not so great at. Hence, why Jeremy is my ying to my yang, because I know I am not great at many of the skillsets that he is prolific in.

Ben Handler:

Yeah, you clearly compliment each other.

Daniel Trelease:

Absolutely, yeah.

Ben Handler:

And, you’ve got different skillsets, different personalities, and that’s what makes a partnership.

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah.

Ben Handler:

And, that’s what grows the company, and that’s what balances off everyone.

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah.

Ben Handler:

Some people who are the more touchy-feely EQ, they’re going to come to you. And, the other ones who aren’t, they’re going to gravitate towards Jeremy, and it works.

Daniel Trelease:

Absolutely.

Ben Handler:

We could be here for hours. We need to do a round two, because we need to hear about some of the stories, if you’re open to sharing. I love your background, I think it’s… I get excited seeing people coming into this space with just, I guess, exposure to life.

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah.

Ben Handler:

Exposure to life, and your exposure is what very few people on this planet have exposure to. And, it’s incredible to see how you’ve brought this into your new business. And, it’s very, you can recognize it very quickly. Just drive past your office in Double Bay, or of anyone watching this now just check out Trelease Associates, right. You can feel it when you look at your brand, it’s something different. And, it’s definitely something that, from what I see, you’ve picked up from what you’ve cultivated previously just in what you’ve learned. For people watching, where can people find Trelease Associates?

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah, look I mean, treleaseassociates.com.au would be the first protocol I think for anyone to have a feel for our company, and who we are, but I’m always an advocate for picking up the phone. Don’t need to email, pick up the phone, and call me. Call me direct, call Jeremy direct, have a conversation. And, if we have a great call get inside, and meet us.

Ben Handler:

Love it. Thank you, appreciate it. We’re going to do a round two. Just finishing up now. Okay, so I hope you enjoyed the discussion, especially around what Daniel learned in his previous career, because that’s very important in terms of how you transfer that into your obviously, new career if you’re looking to do something different.

Ben Handler:

For anyone who’s actually looking to potentially join a company, and become a buyer’s agent, check out Trelease Associates. As Daniel said give him a call, give Jeremy a call, go to their website, see their brand. Actually, look at a lot of the buyers agents that exist, and see if you notice anything different about how they present, what they do, their messaging. I believe you’ll see something quite distinct.

Ben Handler:

So, pick up the phone if you want to chat. And, if you’re someone who’s even looking to buy a property, and you’re looking for that exceptional customer experience, that journey, check out Trelease Associates as well. See you next week.

Please watch the full episode here:

Ben Handler:

Welcome to the Buyer’s Agent Institute Show. The purpose of the show is to bring awareness to buyer’s agents, to bring awareness around the career opportunities that the buyer’s agent sector is providing people. To bring awareness around the value that buyer’s agents providing people who need help buying property. Our goal with the show is to strip back, and dive into the remarkable stories, and journeys of buyer’s agents who are paving the way forward in one of the fastest growing career sectors in Australia right now.

Ben Handler:

Our guest today is Daniel Trelease, he is the founder, and CEO of Trelease Associates, the headquarters is based in Sydney, in Double Bay. Daniel prides himself on two key things, number one, customer service, and number two, developing an extraordinary, and exceptional company culture.

Ben Handler:

Daniel’s career is quite remarkable, it’s also very unique where it started. He was headhunted by the former entertainment media billionaire mogul, Robert Stigwood. Robert Stigwood had a country estate in England, and Daniel managed this estate, and looked after, not just property, but art, but also diversified in understanding different business ventures.

Ben Handler:

Daniel was also engaged by high net worth individuals to buy property, and art across New York, and London. Daniel has been in Australia for less than a decade, and brings a very unique energy into his new business. So, I’m very excited to introduce Daniel Trelease today. Welcome Daniel.

Daniel Trelease:

Thank you very much. Thank you for having me.

Ben Handler:

I’ve always been meaning to ask about this whole Robert Stigwood. He’s obviously a billionaire, he was from Australia, he moved to England. I believe he was the first billionaire in the world.

Daniel Trelease:

I don’t know if he was the first, he was certainly one of the first, and I believe he was one of the first, certainly in Australia. But, he was actually born in Adelaide as well, where I was born. And, that’s I believe certainly, after he passed I started thinking about why me, and I think it was, “I’m going to give this young kid from Adelaide a chance.” And, I’ll be forever grateful for that, because that was the start of my journey.

Ben Handler:

But, how did it all come together?

Daniel Trelease:

I was actually working in the executive club lounge at a hotel, the Hyatt Regency at the time, I think it’s the InterContinental now in Adelaide. And, he said to me, “You don’t seem nervous at all.” And, my boss was there holding the silver tray, shaking like this. And, I said, “I don’t know who you are.” And, he just sort of smiled, and said, “That’s great, no worries.”

Daniel Trelease:

And, I went on with my day, and the next time I had to serve him, eventually the president of his companies at the time said to me, “You’d be really good working with us.” And, it just went from there, then they took me to dinner, and discussed the opportunity. I went, and visited the estate, and Robert, and his team in the Isle of Wight at the time in England, and came back made decision, finished my degree, and went to work for them.

Ben Handler:

When I introduced, and said, “Managed the country estate state,” I mean, a lot of people listening to this won’t probably quite grasp what that really means. Do you mind maybe sharing around the size, the number of staff? I mean, you were managing something very large.

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah, I was effectively what they would call a majordomo, which was the head of the household. So, I would manage all of the staff from the nurses, the security, the chefs, the gardeners, then all of his executive team as well, and everyone in between. Hiring, firing, training, and being the conduit between Robert, and a staff member effectively.

Ben Handler:

How many staff members roughly?

Daniel Trelease:

Just on the estate at any given time between 30, and 40.

Ben Handler:

Wow, amazing. So, what did you learn? I mean, obviously that’s a very unique experience for someone to go through, and be part of that whole journey. What is it that you learned? What was the key thing?

Daniel Trelease:

I think that’s probably where I developed most of my people skills. I was exposed to people that I don’t ever read about, or seen on television. He’s obviously, he was the godfather to a number of the Royal Family’s children, that sort of thing he often visited.

Daniel Trelease:

He’s also the man who created Grease, Saturday Night Fever, Cream, Evita, merge companies, Brian Epstein, run the Beatles for a while, et cetera. And, I actually flew to Melbourne at one point to hire the new gentlemen to take over Saturday Night Fever in the West End, and being thrown in the deep end like that with people that I couldn’t even possibly fathom.

Daniel Trelease:

There was actually one point when I hung up the phone on John Travolta by accident. I was just transferring it to Robert’s quarters, and it just cut out, and I was like sugar. So, anyway I got in a lot of trouble for that. But, Look he called back, and he was fine. The lesson I did learn though, is that with that level of power, and wealth does not always come humility, and decency. And, I know that he had a reputation for being an extraordinarily hard person.

Daniel Trelease:

I mean, everyone knows it’s common knowledge he was hung off of his balcony by the Kray twins, which were mafia, because he was monopolizing the industry. And, I remember one point he called me, I was not in working hours, and I was asked to come up to the main house. I had a house on the estate, and I was asked to come up, and he asked me to come up, which was a 15 minute journey from my house to his, kind of thing. Out of hours, on my very few hours off, to pick a pen up next to his bed, and give it to him when there was 20 staff in the house. To show me that’s your place, don’t ever forget it, kind of thing.

Daniel Trelease:

And, I’ll never forget that moment ever, but I’ll also never forget the moments where he enjoyed glass of champagne, and telling me extraordinary stories, which have enriched my life forever. And, I tell them over, and over are.

Ben Handler:

Can you share any of them?

Daniel Trelease:

They’re probably, a lot of them are rather inappropriate, as you can imagine being a billionaire in the sixties, and seventies, that sort of thing, the sorts of things that went on, but they were very entertaining.

Ben Handler:

Let’s talk about Trelease Associates, because what I love so much about the buyer’s agent sector is they’re so many up, and coming new businesses with people like you have extraordinary skill, and talent. That you’ve then transferred now into this space. And, what you’re doing with Trelease Associates is very unique. I’ve obviously been in the space a long time, and I don’t see really anyone out there in Australia doing what you’re doing. So, what’s the purpose behind what you’re doing? And, what are you looking to do?

Daniel Trelease:

I suppose, from my experience with people mostly, I wanted to create something which wasn’t mine, which wasn’t about me. It wasn’t about feeding me, it wasn’t about growing just me. It was about who can I bring into this company to grow with me for the entire journey. And, I’m not just talking about staff retention. I created Trelease Associates, because I’m the sole owner right now, but it’s created, so then there’s people like, and he most certainly will be Jeremy Bedwani, who I believe is just as important to the success of this company as myself.

Daniel Trelease:

And, I don’t believe it could be what it is even today, 14 months on without him as an example, and other heads of divisions too. So, Trelease Associates was created, so there’ll be associates. There will be obviously myself as the founder, but in time there will be stakeholders like Jeremy, and others in the future as well. So, they own a piece of this company, a significant piece, and it’s not bought, it’s gifted to them.

Daniel Trelease:

It’s about creating a culture where we’re all building a family, a business that can become nationwide, possibly larger, but that’s not the goal. Where we’re working towards a common goal, and every single day I can honestly tell you, we joke, we laugh, we have an amazing time. And, yes there’s difficult times too, and we expect that, and we learn from that, we pivot like we have during COVID.

Ben Handler:

Yeah, and it’s apparent from the outside looking in around what you’re doing. It’s very different, and it seems, as I said earlier, very unique. Let’s talk about the confidentiality part.

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah.

Ben Handler:

That’s something that no one’s doing. Most people in the buyer’s agent space, social media, advertising, it’s all about just bought. You’ve taken a very different approach, do you mind sharing why, and what you’re doing?

Daniel Trelease:

I believe that we’re in customer service, and customer service after spending well over a decade in London, New York, I even lived in Greece for six months. I just feel that it’s missing from the fabric of our society here in Australia. You go to a restaurant, that’s not service. It’s appalling in my eyes. I wanted to create something where the confidentiality piece, we didn’t leverage on our client, and what we bought for them to self promote. We were engaged by our client to source, and to secure a property for them, whether it be investment, whether it be primary residence.

Daniel Trelease:

Not then to plaster that over social media, or to leak it to the media, that sort of thing. It’s about discretion, it’s about a different level of service that Australians perhaps are not entirely used to. That would be expected in say London, and confidentiality is not necessary for all of our clients. Not at all. Most in fact, do not require it, but it is absolutely there for the clients who do.

Daniel Trelease:

It doesn’t just revolve around the confidentiality upon exchange. For example, where the client’s identity is held confidentially with a confidentiality deed signed by the sales agent, the sales agency principal, myself as the principal of Trelease Associates, the buyer’s agent that may have been acting for that buyer, our buyer, and the vendor. All signed, so it’s basically just an extra signature before they sign the contract.

Ben Handler:

Every transaction?

Daniel Trelease:

Not every transaction for the clients that require this. Every client can have it if they wish. Some clients don’t wish for it, they just don’t care, it’s not necessary. Absolutely fine. But, it’s more about what about their buying power? Because, their buying power is usually exposed to most sales agents, because I’ve been looking for one, two, three, six, 12 months before engaging buyer’s agent. Therefore, it’s about confidentiality around the client themselves during the process.

Daniel Trelease:

So, some of these clients, we had one recently that had full confidentiality. No one knows what we bought, no one knows how much we bought it for, and no one is allowed to disclose. That client was even searching at the time. So, that client’s buying power was also confidential. Therefore, because the agents understood where their budget may have been, they needed to know this, they were just working with client five at Trelease Associates.

Ben Handler:

Yeah, it’s extraordinary. And, let’s talk about leadership obviously, and actually before we dive into leadership, I would think that when I opened up, I talked about one of your principles is customer service. It seems like it’s clear, it runs through the DNA of your entire company. Has that been inherited from Robert Stigwood?

Daniel Trelease:

Absolutely.

Ben Handler:

Yeah.

Daniel Trelease:

Unequivocally. I mean, even from my hospitality days, I mean, I remember when my parents didn’t want me to go to acting school, and that sort of thing, which was my passion as a young man. They wanted me to finish my degree, and that sort of thing as I did. But, during that I was working from 16, 15, whatever it was onwards. And, I ended up in silver service in a five star hotel in Adelaide. Therefore, I was poached from Robert, and moved to England.

Daniel Trelease:

And, naturally when you’re serving people from the Royal Family, you’re serving Robert himself, it’s all silver service. And it is the hand behind the back. You’re pretty much leaving the room, walking backwards, that kind of thing. It was very intense. It’s a level of service that almost is nonexistent today, but I revere it.

Ben Handler:

Wow, so you, from being exposed to that, you’ve been able to now transfer just that high quality, because you’re right Australia, it’s poor service.

Daniel Trelease:

Very.

Ben Handler:

And, especially when you go to the States, and come back, you just notice that distinction. So, obviously working at the estate in the UK, you were managing, you were hiring, you were firing, you were strategizing, you were organizing, coordinating, you are a leader. I think we’re all leaders in our own right. Now, you’re running your new company. You’ve got people in various divisions in different States. Has your understanding of leadership changed at all?

Daniel Trelease:

Every day, every single day. Every day I’m learning, even Jeremy, and I learned from each other every day. And, we strategize together every day. But, even after Robert when I worked for TDA Interiors, for example, under Richard Taylor, the founder of TDA Interiors were still operational in South of England, and in central London too. And, watching those different leadership styles from Robert, which is an extraordinary style, I suppose, all the way through to Richard, which was very commercial.

Daniel Trelease:

And, I look at myself as a highly emotional being, hight EQ. Jeremy, high IQ, and very commercial. So, the ying and yang work exceptionally well. We couldn’t be more different in our leadership styles, and that’s probably why we work so well together to create a company that is, I certainly hope I’m right in saying this, not only humble, and not only caring, and compassionate, but we genuinely love, and care for the people inside those walls. And, we will protect them, and nurture them and help them grow, and that’s one of Jeremy’s primary role.

Daniel Trelease:

So, the leadership isn’t just for me, it is across the team. We’ve got Kim Ackerman who’s basically writing the Trelease Associates handbook, for example. On her own accord she came to us. I believe that leadership needs to go across the spectrum of the company, and not just dripped down from the top. I don’t believe in the hierarchy, and the older models. Could be wrong, but at the moment it seems to be doing very well. And, the company as a whole, and the staff are enjoying this leadership style.

Ben Handler:

I agree, the leadership always should really move from the bottom up. And, the fact you’ve got this lady in your office who’s put her hand up to say-

Daniel Trelease:

Absolutely.

Ben Handler:

…I want to take lead with this, is a clear, I guess, indication, and reflection demonstration of what’s really going on in the company. Because, it seems not just customer service is something that runs throughout your entire company, it’s something that obviously you pride so much.

Ben Handler:

Because, I remember back at the Cohen Handler days, you were always having dinner at 10:00 at night at a restaurant with the 65 year old client. And, it seems like you were just forging these very close friendships. So, outside of a transaction your client relationships now becoming friendships, right?

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah, look, there’s three, four clients that have had babies during, or after being a client of mine, and I’ve been in the hospital before they’ve even gotten home with their baby. And, I’ve got 60, 70, 80 plus year old clients who I still take to dinner, because they’re alone, and I truly enjoy their company. I’m an old soul, a lot will say I’m like an eight year old Jewish man, and that’s the joke in the office.

Daniel Trelease:

I suppose I do definitely connect to older people far more than younger. I love being around the youth, and the energy like Jack Henderson in our office, fantastic. He always prides himself, he was a minor, he didn’t finish school, and look at him now.

Ben Handler:

The Flamingo.

Daniel Trelease:

Yes, the Flamingo, right. And, then we’ve got lawyers, and we’ve got forensic accountants, and all sorts of people as well in the company. So, education as well I don’t believe is a factor. You cannot train passion, you cannot train hustle, you can only train skill. And, that’s the biggest lesson that we’ve learned over the last six to 12 months is that don’t just hire someone that’s been in real estate, and need to unravel bad habits, for example. Hire someone who has the passion, hire someone who has the hustle ingrained in them, that is innate in them. Then, and only then let’s train those people.

Ben Handler:

I love it. What do you love about real estate?

Daniel Trelease:

I have to say it’s not even the real estate. It’s the people, because every day I meet someone new, a different character, whether it be a flamingo or something else brought into our life to enrich our lives. And, we’ve got incredibly diverse team of people, and we’re hiring at the moment. So, there’s more people that are coming on board. Some of them are quite characters as well, but you know what, everyone who sits in front of us in the boardroom is different too.

Daniel Trelease:

Some are going to suit my demeanor, and my character. Some are going to suit Jack’s or Kim’s or Annabelle’s or whoever’s. And, that’s why also we need to figure out who aren’t we servicing, who aren’t we helping, and how can we help them. So, we’re looking at a commercial division that has never been done before. We have tried, it didn’t pan out the way Jeremy, and I had wanted it to, and that’s fine.

Daniel Trelease:

We live, and we learn, we pivot, and we evolve. And, now we’re looking at someone who, whether this person comes to fruition or not, this is someone who is at very high level, and was head of acquisitions for a very well known firm. And, we’re looking at bringing them on, so we can service the commercial clients, and buyers out there.

Daniel Trelease:

We’re looking at the property management division that we’re building very assertively, and right now we’re only six months away from launching Brisbane. Less than 12 months away from launching Mosman. And, it’s about not expanding too quickly, not trying to take over any kind of world domination, as they say, it’s about who can we service, and service well.

Daniel Trelease:

And, you know what? Sometimes we’ll fail, so we’ll pivot, we’ll try again, or we’ll move on, and we want to figure out what we’re great at. And, that’s been my biggest lesson, what I’m great at, and what I’m not so great at. Hence, why Jeremy is my ying to my yang, because I know I am not great at many of the skillsets that he is prolific in.

Ben Handler:

Yeah, you clearly compliment each other.

Daniel Trelease:

Absolutely, yeah.

Ben Handler:

And, you’ve got different skillsets, different personalities, and that’s what makes a partnership.

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah.

Ben Handler:

And, that’s what grows the company, and that’s what balances off everyone.

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah.

Ben Handler:

Some people who are the more touchy-feely EQ, they’re going to come to you. And, the other ones who aren’t, they’re going to gravitate towards Jeremy, and it works.

Daniel Trelease:

Absolutely.

Ben Handler:

We could be here for hours. We need to do a round two, because we need to hear about some of the stories, if you’re open to sharing. I love your background, I think it’s… I get excited seeing people coming into this space with just, I guess, exposure to life.

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah.

Ben Handler:

Exposure to life, and your exposure is what very few people on this planet have exposure to. And, it’s incredible to see how you’ve brought this into your new business. And, it’s very, you can recognize it very quickly. Just drive past your office in Double Bay, or of anyone watching this now just check out Trelease Associates, right. You can feel it when you look at your brand, it’s something different. And, it’s definitely something that, from what I see, you’ve picked up from what you’ve cultivated previously just in what you’ve learned. For people watching, where can people find Trelease Associates?

Daniel Trelease:

Yeah, look I mean, treleaseassociates.com.au would be the first protocol I think for anyone to have a feel for our company, and who we are, but I’m always an advocate for picking up the phone. Don’t need to email, pick up the phone, and call me. Call me direct, call Jeremy direct, have a conversation. And, if we have a great call get inside, and meet us.

Ben Handler:

Love it. Thank you, appreciate it. We’re going to do a round two. Just finishing up now. Okay, so I hope you enjoyed the discussion, especially around what Daniel learned in his previous career, because that’s very important in terms of how you transfer that into your obviously, new career if you’re looking to do something different.

Ben Handler:

For anyone who’s actually looking to potentially join a company, and become a buyer’s agent, check out Trelease Associates. As Daniel said give him a call, give Jeremy a call, go to their website, see their brand. Actually, look at a lot of the buyers agents that exist, and see if you notice anything different about how they present, what they do, their messaging. I believe you’ll see something quite distinct.

Ben Handler:

So, pick up the phone if you want to chat. And, if you’re someone who’s even looking to buy a property, and you’re looking for that exceptional customer experience, that journey, check out Trelease Associates as well. See you next week.

Please watch the full episode here:

Data-Driven Property Investment

Buyer's agent Kyrillos Mansour

Before becoming a full-time buyers agent, Kyrillos Mansour clearly had a passion for property.

While learning what fundamentals drove property price growth, he built up his own database of every suburb in Australia, with 100 data points per suburb. At the time, Kyrillos was working as an optometrist, but he quickly realised his passion lay elsewhere in property.

“I always had an interest in property and in business. While I was working as an optometrist, I was doing my own property investing and I was building up my own database of information and research regarding different suburbs in different states in Australia because at the time I didn’t really have enough money to invest in Sydney.”

“I thought, if I want to invest outside of Sydney, I need to learn about the other suburbs in different states.”

Kyrillos built a huge database and quickly built up an understanding of how to identify suburbs and areas that were set to grow in value rapidly.

“I started compiling my own data and that became a huge Excel spreadsheet of every single home in every state in Australia – about 60 to 100 data points per suburb and I just kept getting more interested, more fascinated.”

“I started seeing how property can make people money and how you can generate wealth and pretty much just fell in love with it from that point on.”

After successfully building his own property portfolio, he was quickly approached by friends and family to help them achieve success in the same fashion as him.

“After I had bought my first few investments myself, a few friends and family members asked me, “how did you know about that suburb? How did you know where to go and the strategies to use?” So I started sharing my spreadsheet and data, with them.”

“In the end, I was pretty much doing a buyer’s agent’s job for them and really enjoying it.”

After making the decision to move into helping others achieve success as a buyers agent, Kyrillos slowly started to build up his business.

“The business itself is only just over 12 months old, but I’ve been buying property for people for around three years.”

“The first 12 months is always difficult no matter what business it is. I think a buyer’s agent is even harder because it doesn’t really exist in Australia, it’s such a small industry.”

After a slow start, he focused on giving value and educating others on property and then the business started to grow.

“For the first four months there were no customers, then we got the first customer and it was quite a big achievement.”’

“It took a while to go from number one to customer two. It took a little bit of time from two to three. Once we got to about five done, it just started to roll like the compound interest rule – the same thing with people.”

“This month I think we’ve been working on seven clients in a month.”

“The first 12 months has been a huge learning curve in terms of how to get customers and I see other buyer’s agents who probably achieve customers quicker, but I think the way I approached it about free education, giving out, giving out, it’s bringing in quality leads as well and building a brand.”

With his background in data, Kyrillos helps all types of home buyers and investors, locate properties all across the country.

When Kyrillos was getting the business off the ground, he was able to reach out to the BAI, to help at times when it was difficult finding the right way to move forward with the business.

“My idea of the Buyer’s Agent Institute course when I first started was someone’s going to teach me how to buy property. Very quickly I realised that wasn’t it. It was more so how to run a buyer’s agency business.”

“When I was first starting and I was a bit struggling to get any sort of leads, I used to message Ben. I said, “Hey, Ben. I’m struggling a bit. What do you reckon?” He said, “Yeah, come in for a chat”.

“When we spoke about things he said, “How about you explore this option? How about you explore that? He wanted to see me succeed.”

Going forward, Kyrillos’ goal is to both educate and help people achieve success through his company First Brick Property.

For people looking to get into a career as a buyers agent, Kyrillos suggests you need to be passionate and be looking to do it for the right reason.

“You’ve got be passionate about it, you’ve got to really understand it.”

“Equip yourself with the fundamentals of property by listening to every podcast you can find, read every book you can find, learn about all the different strategies you can find because everyone in Australia’s a property expert so if you’re going to charge for it, you really need to know what you’re talking about.

This Is How You Can Use Your Skills Wisely

Buyer's Agent Anthony Spagnolo on how you can use your skills wisely

Ben Handler:

Welcome to the Buyer’s Agents Institute show. The purpose of the show is to bring awareness to buyers agents to bring awareness around the career opportunities at the buyer’s agent sector is providing people to bring awareness around the value that buyers AINS providing to people who need help buying property. Our goal with the show is to strip back and dive into the remarkable stories and journeys of buyers agents who are paving the way forward in one of the fastest growing career sectors in real estate in Australia. Right now. Our guest today is Anthony Spagnolo. He runs Agenzia in Western Sydney and he has got a very, very in depth level I believe of diverse experience. He brings to the table, he’s a licensed real estate agent. He’s a qualified accountant. He’s a licensed builder. He is a property developer and he’s also stayed at university, a bachelor of commerce and accounting and he runs his buyer’s agent business to focus on higher yielding properties across Australia.

He primarily, at the moment, he’s focusing in Queensland and he’s also taken a focus, which we’ll talk about in this show, in an area in a disability area called NDS. That’s the acronym which we’ll dive into soon. I’m super excited to dive into this discussion with Anthony today. I’d like to introduce Anthony.

Anthony Spagnolo:

Thanks for having me. Thanks for the intro.

Ben Handler:

Did I get that intro? Okay. I would say there’s a lot of good skills you bring to the table. It’s obviously very diverse. Do a lot of declines. Have a talk about what you bring to the table. Uh, let’s turn the truth.

Anthony Spagnolo:

Uh, to tell you the truth, it’s throughout, it’s in trying to find my actual job title to this point. So I’ve, yeah, Buyer’s agent is just the part of what I do is essentially had an accounting business for 12 years, moved out of that space into property development and my love for real estate. It’s led me down this path into, uh, into becoming a buyer’s agent or property strategist as such.

Ben Handler:

So you didn’t strike me as the accountant.

Anthony Spagnolo:

Well, that’s why I’m of of diversified. Uh, it’s, it was good stepping stone. Um, gave me broad, a broader, uh, range of knowledge I guess, and uh, onto the nexts project, which is now my passion for property. So, um, we’re really trying to push this business to take it to the next level.

Ben Handler:

Yeah. I, I mean, I really do believe you bring a lot to the table. I mean, having an accounting background, focusing in development and understanding building and obviously buying property yourself. I mean, it’s a lot you bring to the table and so it’s going to be exciting to see how you roll this into this new business of yours. You, we talked earlier and I know that you, you, you’ve put a focus into, obviously you focus on high yielding properties, but you’ve taken a, uh, a liking and a focus into what is called NDIS. Yes. Do you mind sharing like what is NDIS and NDIS stands for?

Anthony Spagnolo:

National Disability Insurance Scheme. And the part of the plans that we’re focusing on is called SDA, which is Specialized Disability Accommodation. It’s a fairly new scheme, early sort of been legislated in the last, uh, two years. Uh, most of the properties are only under construction at the moment. That’s new builds because it’s so complex and there’s a lot of compliance to be, uh, SDA approved so that the participants who are the people with disabilities or tech tenants can move into these properties cause they have to obviously be, uh, purposely built and signed off on. So they’re, um, regulated I guess. So. So essentially there’s 30,000 participants or people waiting to get a sufficient housing, uh, Australia wide. So yes, there’s a lot there. That’s the supply. The supply can’t meet the demand currently.

Ben Handler:

My next question is like, why did you take a liking and a focus into this?

Anthony Spagnolo:

Uh, it was through a chance, um, conversation or meeting with a colleague of mine who’s based in Brisbane. Uh, he was representing a company up there and I said, why didn’t you have a look at this is unbelievable returns, uh, often between 10 to 20% a year, net yields per annum. So I said, well, that got me sort of looking at it. Also, I have a cousin that has, uh, had cerebral palsy and can and have, it’s close to my heart. I guess that seeing what families go through behind the scenes as well as knowing some other, um, uh, participants and meeting a lot, uh, throughout our journey of doing research and reverse engineering the whole process. It’s just, uh, it’s taken us down the path that we, we feel, uh, an obligation to work, work out all the moving parts so that we can, um, yeah, help, help, uh, provide the specialized housing to these people.

Ben Handler:

I don’t know a lot about this space, but, well, from what I read in here, it seems complicated. And for someone like you who’s got a special cause, um, it’s, it’s, it’s close to your heart. You obviously know property very well. And so it seems like you’re going to be this perfect solution to come to the table to help make the experience a lot easier for people. Why do you think it’s been so difficult?

Anthony Spagnolo:

Well the, the, it’s not like just, uh, purchasing a standard property for, for an investor, then taking a tour and an agent to manage it and find tenants. Uh, it’s basically you gotta start from the ground up prior to finding the location, which means that you’ve got to deal with care providers. There’s 7,000, uh, accommodation care providers or thereabouts, Australia wide. So you can’t just build it in a certain location and hope that they will come. It’s a matter of going to these care providers or coordinators to work out which clients in which areas are requiring which level of housing. And then then we will sort of go through the, the criteria of what makes a property good. If it’s close to um, uh, transport station. Obviously a lot of the people that live in these houses are wheelchair bound, so it just needs to be, uh, in the right location so they can have a quality, like a good lifestyle, I guess. And, and convenience.

Ben Handler:

Where do you think the gap is? I mean in terms of like, do you think being that group like you are, who can say this is the right care provider, this is where we should buy. Like e.g., we should go to Queensland. This is the right product. Like do you think it’s, do you think there’s a gap or there’s a need to find someone like yourself to help package it all up?

Anthony Spagnolo:

Oh definitely. Cause if it’s a normal person just goes out to put a bought or build SDI house hoping that they’ll get high returns and haven’t done their due diligence in groundwork, the house can be empty log. There’s no point just building it for the sake of building it I guess. Uh, um, like I said by, by going through the process and reverse engineering it, we’ve gone all the way back to what the participants require with houses. So we’ve actually surveyed a lot of participants and just through our work with the care providers, with our builders that are preferred builders, we come up, we have come up with some really good designs that make the house has, is really functional for the needs of the participants. And then we also have those intimate relationships with the care providers on an ongoing basis to know where we should be sourcing. Then knowing that we’ll have investors come to us. And so we sort of reverse the process of working out what the requirements are of the people that are moving into the houses and where they’re located. And then we’ll match them with the investors and our developers and builders to like one stop solution.

Ben Handler:

And it’s a big, it’s a big space to be operating in and there’s massive obviously shortage of supply. High demand. Why would someone, okay, then the net yields, you said between 10 and 20%. It’s very high.

Anthony Spagnolo:

Yeah. In some cases it can vary from it depending on local does the land components, uh, the major variable factor. So the rates that the SDI pay, you only change by location. Very minimally. So it’s more so if you want to go close to a CBD, then the land component is going to be higher. Then you may be affected, however you might get a higher capital growth.

Ben Handler:
But the yields are very attractive?

Anthony Spagnolo:

That’s what they’re very attractive. But for me personally, like as, as I mentioned, it’s more of the feelgood factor of helping people get the right housing and it’s a social scheme. It’s the second biggest social scheme only behind Medicare.

Ben Handler:

It’s interesting because let’s just say I’m an I, I’m an investor. What do you feel like most investors would be looking at this? Obviously there’s, there’s very intent behind it. You’re, you know, it’s not just a standard purchase you’re providing and giving someone a place to be, but obviously the yields are attractive.  What else would be attractive for an investor is a capital growth. Like what…

Anthony Spagnolo:

If we can purchase in the right locations, which we like, we know where like even like you mentioned, we do a lot of work in Southeast Queensland. We know those suburbs like intimately and we know where we should be purchasing and we’ve got projections on growth and whatnot. So we’re able to definitely as well as getting the high, high, um, cashflow or, or yields, we’re able to get capital growth for our clients too. So that’s great. Yeah. Without some level of risks. Like, obviously the rewards high, but um, at present, yeah, the lending criteria is, uh, you need a little bit more deposit to get into one of these properties because, uh, they’re cause they’re fitted out to such a high standard. There’s a short sometimes in vows for the fit out costs. But that’s just a thought. I’ll put that out there.

Ben Handler:

What would you say the average average purchase prices waste from all we’ve been purchasing on behalf of our clients?

Anthony Spagnolo:

Look, we for say a four bedroom or, or could be a three bedroom with a Oh eight quarters, which is, uh, for an overnight carer, um, the standard builds around 500,000 or thereabouts. That’s, so that’s essentially a four bedroom SDA home. But as you go down, you can get three bedroom, two bedrooms, so you can, the price range would be, would probably start at five 50 to 600 K in Queensland to probably up to a million probably. But it’s high. I mean, I’ve seen some of the specs and what it looks like. It’s, it looks very good quality or very high quality or, or bath or bedrooms have large bathrooms. But for wheelchair access, uh, there’s a breakout area for when participants have their families over kitchen shared living. So they’re, they’re really well thought designs and they do provide a great level of comfort and livability for the participants.

Ben Handler:

What’s your view on, I mean at the moment with what’s going on with the, the economy at the moment? This pandemic tenant security is obviously an issue in just not just rezzy commercial everywhere. Have you seen a change in like investors who are looking at NDI indice because obviously there’s going to be no issue with tenant security. Have you seen there’s been more people who want to get in or…

Anthony Spagnolo:

there is a lot I think as, as the people who come more aware of the scheme and what indices like it’s quite new to a lot of people. So there has been just general, uh, increase as we’ve sort of, um, began over 12 months ago. We’ve seen a steady increase of, uh, interest. However, w a S like a selling point that, uh, identified as being during coronavirus that there is government guarantees and the governments is essentially the government’s the one that will be paying you the rent on behalf of the participants. So you have a 10 plus five plus five lease, um, with the SDA. So tenant security and risk of not receiving rent isn’t a problem. So if anything, um, we’ve come up with a solution to overcome any objections due to the current market crosses. It’s very attractive. How has been the experience?

Ben Handler:

I mean you obviously, I know you’ve gone through and done quite a lot of purchases already. You’re very busy. How, I mean obviously I just wanted to get a check in, like how’s the experience been from finding the property for the your client?

Anthony Spagnolo:

Yeah, it’s been, it’s been a challenge local, low. As I mentioned, we’ve sort of gone through Oh 10, 15 different, uh, builders that we’ve interviewed and vetted and, and also service providers who, so you’ve got the care providers are, they’re the ones who look after the whole India’s plan for the participants. However, then you’ve got the service providers who are the ones, they’re essentially like a lock, the agent of the property, but on a high level because there’s a lot more compliance and reporting that needs to be done to the, with them to the SDA to maintain the compliance of the property.

Um, as well. They need those relationships with, um, the care providers on an ongoing basis to make sure that, um, the tenants are happy looked after and if there is, uh, an event that a tenant may be relocating or moving out, that they’ve got someone else lined up to, to fill that spot. And we ha we don’t have a high occupy, uh, if I can see rights, uh, on these properties. So the, in most cases they’re fully occupied majority of the time due to the fact that there’s not sufficient housing around for the participants at this stage.

Ben Handler:

Do you see the business going really heavily all in, into the San Diego, in gen Z into the induce phase? We’re not pigeonholed to induce I guess, but it is a niche that we’ve really, uh, we’d like to call ourselves specialist in and we’ve been, like I said, we’ve done a fair few transactions in this space.

Anthony Spagnolo:

So we are, we are really in, uh, enjoying the challenge and enjoying being like, um, we want to be someone that people will come to to come up with the solution. And we’re, we’re at the point where we’re confident that we’ve got multiple solutions available or, yeah, it’s so needed. I mean, it just seems like a space that if you’re trying to go through it yourself 7,000 provide, like it just seems like it’d be a nightmare. Yeah, it is. That’s why you need the right service provider to have those relationships in specific areas. Obviously you can’t deal with all of them and they’re spread out across Australia. However, it’s, uh, it’s having those solid relationships that we can confidently put our investors into these properties knowing that they’ll be looked off, look, looked after and going forward, that the properties will perform for them. And we think that without designs with future proofing the properties, uh, for the investors, so when more more properties come on the market and uh, and they catch up with the demands that our properties are still going to be the best properties that people want to live in.

Ben Handler:

Yeah. And it’s great that you, you’re reverse engineering the entire process. Is anyone else going about it that way?

Anthony Spagnolo:

Um, look we’ve met a lot of good people in this space and a lot of passionate people because everyone’s got a story. They know someone that’s affected or someone that needs the housing happy to help people. Even if they’re looking for housing and not an investor where we’ve got the right connections to point them in the right direction to be able to come up with whatever solution they may need. If it’s from a holistic approach of getting someone that specialized in actual the hope doing the whole plans, cause they can be quite complex. So we look, we’re happy to just help in any way we can. In this space. You’re primarily buying

Ben Handler:

Queensland. Do you see yourself going in any other state?

Anthony Spagnolo:

Obviously the land in Queensland has been cheaper than what new South Wales or Sydney has been. So that’s why the use can be higher. It’s just sort of where we started. However, we, we’ve got some partnerships now that in the next two, two months we should have some really good options available in Sydney or broader new South Wales, central coast, Hunter Valley. We’ve got, we’ve got things in the pipeline or other partnerships that we can sort of definitely facilitate for that.

Ben Handler:

Nice. And so how have you found on a different note like the buyer’s agent space, obviously you working in the accounting space for a long time, pretty different to the buyer’s agent space. Are you, are you enjoying the style of service model?

Anthony Spagnolo:

Oh yeah, very much so. I enjoyed it. Um, as uh, you mentioned I was doing a CA counting and then I went into property development. Uh, larger scale developments was sort of what my family business was. So that’s how I sort of got my builder’s license along the way. Cause I was project managing our jobs and said, well one of our come a build up. But that’s not the direction I sort of went. And, uh, what I was doing as an accountant and now as a licensed real estate agent is, uh, a little bit of a hype, uh, hybrid between sort of, like I said, it’s property stretched strategists and it’s not yet. It’s not just the South side of things. It’s all been able to have those partnerships in the background with brokers, solicitors, other accountants, um, and AIS, it’s just having multiple relationships and also a marketing team behind me, uh, and just working with clever people that can really, um, give a client a holistic view and a strategy to move forward as opposed to just purchasing a one property. We want to look further further than that and actually help them build a portfolio and wealth. So,

Ben Handler:

yeah, and that’s, that’s what I was saying at the beginning. I think what you bring to the table in terms of skill and knowledge is incredibly unique. And then focusing that into indice like w what’s the right product and what’s the right area to buy in. And so because you’ve got that building experience, you’ve got the development experience, you’ve got the accounting background. Like it’s a lot of value it brings to the client.

Anthony Spagnolo:

Yeah. Well when we build a property like it’s not just set and forget and move on like part of my services locked off for the client that throughout the project I will essentially be project managing from a building level. Even though there’s a, we’ve got our preferred builders and it’s, we know that it’s in trusted hands. A client wants to know throughout a 20 week build cycle. I guess a client still wants updates. They want to know where it’s at and, and we’ll be even on site having a look with the builder and just making sure, keeping track of it. I can show everything’s on track I guess.

Ben Handler:

I think it’s awesome. What you’re doing I think is incredibly unique. There’s, I think it’s, I, it’s obviously a very big space I think to play in and there doesn’t there done from what I’ve seen that doesn’t seem like there’s that holistic, uh, group out there that can provide, has got that hybrid model to really service the client. I’m so mad I can’t wait to see what you’re going to do in this space. It’s exciting. Where can, as we wrap up, where can people find you.

Anthony Spagnolo:

On my website, Agenzia.com.au or Anthony Spagnolo. Uh, that would be, I’m happy to talk to anyone anytime with numbers on there. Give me a call, drop me an email and just happy to help in any way possible.

Ben Handler:

I love it. My well done. I’m pumped to see what you’re going to do in the future in this space. I really am. So thanks for joining. I appreciate it. For sure. Cheers. Okay, so check out Anthony at Agenzia.com.au. If you want to learn more about this NDIS space, it’s a very unique space and Anthony has got all the skills and putting a lot of the time the energy has put in the effort to build relationships so people can really understand this space and not many people in my opinion, really intricately do. So reach out to Anthony if you have any questions, check him out. He’s really passionate about serving this space and so I’m really excited to see where it goes cause there’s such a lack of supply and I think a lack of a consolidated skillset to support this industry. So check them out. See you next week.

Please watch the full episode here:

Accounting, Building and Helping Clients

With a background as an accountant, understanding the numbers in a property deal was never a problem for Anthony Spagnolo.

However, it was a number of years after he started running the family accounting firm, that he realised that he wanted to pursue property as his full-time profession.

“My background was accounting, having a family accounting firm for 12 years, which I took over from my father.”

“My father was already an avid property investor and had a side property investment business as well.”

“We were doing all sorts of different property developments, residential units, land sub-divisions, commercial, industrial. A broad range of things that gave me a real insight from the DA approval process all the way through to completion.”

After leaving the accounting business, Anthony decided to take on property full time and also focused on building.

“Along the way I was project managing some jobs, I got my builder’s licence as well and I was also investing in our own projects.”

“I had around five years of experience doing my own developments outside the family group, which was mainly townhouses and duplexes Sydney-wide, which I was project managing.”

After building up the property side of his business, he started to run into issues with the number of projects he could handle and decided he needed to change things up.

“Around a year and a half ago I realised that I was getting limited with my buying capacity and the number of projects I could do at any one time. “

“I needed a new challenge and I missed working with clients from an accounting perspective so that’s where my property advisory business came about.”

With an extensive background in building and development, Anthony began focusing on new stock and identifying opportunities for clients that often come directly from developers. He also recognised that there was a whole in the market after working with a number of buyers agents in his previous business that didn’t add value to their clients.

As he was getting established as a buyers agent, Anthony discovered the BAI which helped him in a range of areas, particularly with sales and lead generation.

“I started things off with Ben last April and got my real estate licence mid last year. It was a bit of a learning experience all around especially with lead generation.”

“Ben focuses on having a process and a system and not coming from a sales background it took some real adjustments. Early on it was a hard slog, but in the last four or five months I’ve actually felt something shift, which is great.”

Even though Anthony had a background in property, there was still plenty to take away from the BAI program.

“I had already a bit of a real estate background to a certain extent in selling some of our own projects off the plan. However, Ben’s course was totally different because you have to sell a client on your value and why they should pay a fee to engage you and also to source that property.”

Going forward Anthony’s goal is to continue helping clients and grow his business.

“I want to see clients as repeat business going forward, helping them grow their portfolio.”

“It’s good to see other people being able to what we’ve done ourselves, as an investor. A lot of people come to you for advice and sometimes you take it for granted the knowledge that you have thorough experience and it’s good to help people that are starting and then educate them and move them on to bigger and better things.”

You Paint Your Picture

Buyer's Agent Kitty Parker on painting your own picture

Ben Handler:

Welcome to the buyer’s agent Institute show. The purpose of the show is to bring awareness to buyers agents to bring awareness around the career opportunities that the buyer’s agent sector is providing people to bring awareness around the value that buyers agents are providing, people who need help buying property. Our goal with the show is to strip back and dive into the remarkable stories and journeys of buyer’s agents who are paving the way forward in one of the fastest growing career sectors in real estate. Right now.

Our guest today is Kitty Parker from Kitty Mile. She is not your average buyer’s agent. She has a very broad range of skill and talent. She’s been involved in start-up businesses, one of the most recent ones where she grew a multi-national corporate start-up. She also has tertiary qualifications that is quite diverse, ranging from policy ranging from strategic management and psychology. She is a single mother and she brings a certain level of freshness, I believe, to the buyer’s agent space. She’s not just here to serve clients and buy property. She’s here. I feel to bring innovation into this sector. I’m really excited to introduce Kitty and dive into today. Welcome, Kitty.

Kitty Miles:

Thank you so much. I was so nice. I thought you said lovely to meet you. Thank you for having me here today.

Ben Handler:

Yeah, I really appreciate it. And I remember I saw you online last year, end of last year and I thought this lady is going to crush it. She’s bringing new energy into these games.

Kitty Miles:

Thank you. I do my best. Yes.

Ben Handler:

Kitty Miles. So, it’s Kitty Parker. Kitty is for Katherine for short?

Kitty Miles:

No, my first name is Kristine-Elizabeth, hyphenated, which is ridiculous. And I have a middle name as well. So I’ve been called Kitty for ages because Kristine-Elizabeth is way too long.

Ben Handler:

The name of the business. What’s the Miles?

Kitty Miles:

Miles is my youngest son, so he’s 20. And there was a bit of a story behind miles, but um, yeah, naming the company after my son is really that mother and son connection, which I guess flows through with being a single mum, et cetera. And it’s uh, I guess providing a bit of a stance there out there as this is mom and son corporation.

Ben Handler:

You seem like you’ve entered this space with what? I can see a different purpose. And I say that because I appreciate that you’ve got different skills, you’ve got different talents and you’re now, from what I’m seeing, integrating it now into the buyer’s agent arena. What did you find and what did you see when you entered this space even before you started? What did you see?

Kitty Miles:

I guess as a starting point, being a single mom living in Sydney, in the rental market, you really get a feel for how unaffordable housing is. So that was the catalyst for me, maneuvering from my university qualifications and going down that path and thinking I really need to come up with a game plan here to set up the future financial security for my family. That allowed me to diverge into business. It was a real, um, survival instinct. And so I took that plunge into business, realized I had a passion for that. I had a skill at that, let’s just say, nailed that. So that gave me, um, the ability to begin, like to dive into having a investment property portfolio. So it gave me the funds to buy property while I was buying property. However, I engaged buyers, agents myself cause I was very time poor as a business woman.

And while their service was good, there were a few shortcomings. Let’s just say the buyer’s agents that I dealt with, there were some shortcomings. So at the wrapping this all up in the summary version is it all culminated in me selling my last business and going, you know what? I understand property now I know what people want from customer service. Having dealt with buyer’s agents myself and realizing, gee, I wish I’d done this or that. So now I try and give to my clients what I wanted given to myself. I also learned along the way obviously stumbling through buying property for myself and utilizing buyer’s agents. I came to understand the property market more and more. Having a background in data and statistics, I realized that, you know, crunching numbers and the property marker was like, I’m an untapped passion. So that was great and it all just culminated into me realizing this is a really natural progression for me. It really allows me to bring all my skills together and deliver for people in a way that I guess my psychology degree is about serving people. So this is like another version of that.

Ben Handler:

Yeah, and I respect that. I had seen that you’ve just got such a diverse level I think of skill and talent and the way that you integrate it into this particular service. It fits really well. Like the psychology we’re dealing with people. It’s communication. You’ve got a lot of experience with data and obviously business skills, which helps you I guess build the foundations of this new business. So this new business, it’s based head office in Sydney. Your you’re serving clients on a national level, correct?

Kitty Miles:

That’s correct. I’m based in Sydney but I service not just Sydney and the New South Wales state. I’m actually licensed in multiple States, so I purchase for people across multiple States of Australia. So this means it’s more often the case that people that are wanting to purchase investment properties interstate say they may already have a Sydney based investment property and they’re wanting to diversify their portfolio. Having someone they can meet in Sydney and chat to and having someone that understands the interstate markets individually. I find clients that they seem that they see that is very helpful. So yes, I serve as Sydney, New South Wales and interstate.

Ben Handler:

It’s awesome. Your business. Um, we had an earlier conversation. You started in end of 2018 and it’s grown very quickly. I mean, I’m not surprised. Did you, entering into this space, obviously it’s very niche. Did you expect it to move so quick? Like did you have expectations or..

Kitty Miles:

I certainly didn’t have expectations. Snowballing skyrocket as much as it has done. I’m very thankful and feel very blessed that it has done so exceptionally well when I’ve reviewed that and gone, gee, I’ve done so well in such a short period of time. I guess for me, honestly that boils down to, I think it’s the level of personalized customer service and customer care that I deliver. Um, and as I say, I learned that myself based on what I had hoped to receive from buyer’s agents. So I think that’s very much the catalyst as to why my business has done well. It’s what I do and the extent that I go to for my clients. I think it also is in the, in a humble way, my data analysis capabilities and I’m that I’m very passionate about statistics and data. Um, so my ability to interpret property market data is in the nicest way, I guess advanced. So I think the combination of being able to forecast well, uh, accurately appraise properties as well as just deliver a really down to earth caring customer experience. I think I was together have been the kind of secret ingredient in the source, so to speak.

Ben Handler:

Client experience. So you clearly delivering which should be the normal, like a first class style of experience. It seems like you’re connecting with them and you’re, you’re taking it to a new level, which I think, I mean you’ve got an American accent, so you’re Australian, right? You lived in the US I mean with my minimal experience in the US I always feel like they understand service more than Australia. So it seems like in Australia when you offer good services like Oh, but it should be part of the norm. Like what is it with your clients? Is it just your, you’re communicating daily? Like what is it you feel like that you’re doing, which is really I guess enhancing that overall experience.

Kitty Miles:

I think you’re very correct in pointing out that I would say I have a very American customer service style that it’s from the point of initially, um, chatting with a potential client, right through to the little detail, the attention to detail in answering all their questions are pre-empting their questions. Really trying to know when to assist a client at making an efficient decision and when to pull back and actually knowing someone needs a little bit more support or a little bit more time to think about things. And I think I’m very honest. So if I feel someone maybe taking longer to make a decision or, or making a decision based on emotion when it, when it should probably be more financially based, I’ll really politely call them on it and I’ll say, Hey, let’s just open up this conversation. And, and let’s discuss this or this or this.

And sometimes clients, I find they’re just so appreciative that you’re really actively listening and working with them. It’s not a cookie cutter model that you’re really looking at that person as an individual and looking at their brief, looking at their needs and also looking at their psychological reasons behind buying property. There have been so many clients, not so many, but I should say a handful of clients that I’ve halfway through went hang on a minute, time out. Do you really even want to buy a property? And they’ve gone what? And I’m like, why do you want to buy a property? And they’ve gone, well we should. That’s what we do. We’re married, we should. And I’m like, hang on a minute. And we’ve discussed it and they’ve actually walked away and gone. That is so refreshing. Yeah, we don’t want to buy a property. We want to rent. And I think that’s the difference that you really need to know your client and really work with their best interests at heart.

Ben Handler:

I love that. I haven’t heard that one before. And you, you don’t strike me as the salesy type more the consultative as you said, the listening, you got two ears and you, you’re there, you’re operating with integrity. And I think that’s quite rare in Australia for real estate and unfortunately there’s parts of the real estate arena which has a bad reputation. Um, and obviously your clients admire that and it’s, it’s obviously a Testament to the way your business has grown because you’ve grown a multiple six figure business in a very short period of time. I’m curious to know what do you see, just with your, with your lens at the moment, what are the opportunities in the buyer’s agent space that you’re seeing?

Kitty Miles:

There are huge opportunities in the buyer’s agent space. I feel one of my, one of my mission statements, so my business is I really want to change the way in which people buy property. And I think there is great potential in the buyer’s agent space and I think it is a really fantastic arena for people that come from other careers, either corporate careers or just other careers and that they can bring that knowledge and that information. And, and the gifts from, from many years in another career into this space. And I really think that that counts for a lot in this arena because you’re not just dealing with property, you’re dealing with people, you’re dealing with their wants, their needs, their desires, and having someone with a well rounded background, I just feel it fits in with that equation so well gone are the days where you need to have 30 years experience in the real estate industry to understand real estate. I feel that you can bring a really fresh and innovative energy approach and skills to this space. Having come from a different career, not saying experience is nothing, but I just think we can actually look at it differently and enhance on the buyer’s agent space that we have now.

Ben  Handler:

Music to my ears and I, and I think the innovation and the change that this space is gonna have over the next number of years moving forward is going to be from people like yourself who’ve worked in different sectors, have a different brain, have a different approach, different freshness. They’re going to help change this industry. It’s not going to be the people who just know how to buy property. That’s not, that’s not difficult. The difficult part I think is the business aspect and we’re gonna need more people who’ve done different things in different areas of business to come into this space and serve at a different level.

Kitty Miles:

I agree. I absolutely agree.

Ben Handler:

Talk to me around where is the next move for kitty miles? Like are you planning on just staying where you are at the moment? Are you looking to expand? Like what’s on the agenda for you…

 

Kitty Miles:

At the moment, I’m looking to scale my business. It’s done very well in a short space of time. I would love to scale my business to provide further reach for the service, assist more people because as one person I can assist this many people, but what I’m really hoping to achieve is that synergy between scaling and also keeping the boutique nature of my business. I don’t want to become factory line. I don’t want to become cookie cutter and I don’t want to sell out by scaling too quickly, too fast, to too much, and actually lose the touch that I feel. I bring my business that has made my business so successful. But my plan is to scale. Um, I’m also writing a book at the moment, uh, on property because I really, I’m a little bit over the myth that millennials can’t get into the property market. Um, I assist a lot of millennials, not just to get into the property market, but to actually believe they can even get into the property market because media seems to tell them that they’re going to have to give up their Avro smash if they have any hope of getting into property.

And I’m like, no, you can keep your avo smashed and we can get you into property as well. So I decided, you know, I want to open up this space. I want to write a book to help the particular demographics that I feel real estate just, you know, brushes onto the carpet. People like millennials, people like single moms, people like the LGBTQ community. They’re the buyers in the space at the moment. I’m not your typical mom and dad buyers. There’s so many more people buying property and I really want to do something to help these people get into the market, feel confident in the market and know what they’re doing. So ultimately it boils down to I really want to help create in property wealth, creation for all rather, than it just be kind of a minority that do well through greed per se. I want everyone to be able to own property.

Ben Handler:

I love how there’s, there is a focus on the millennials because there is, I think there’s limitation for millennials who are growing up who were looking at the paper, who were thinking, I can’t get into this market because the media is creating a narrative, creating a lot of fear and it’s amazing that you’ve got clients in that space or you’re servicing because they really do need help. A lot of them have never bought property before and there’s so much fear within them that there’s probably a high probability they’re going to make the wrong decision anyway.

Ben Handler:

Thank you. Yes, but spot on. Couldn’t agree more. I think that you know, there are so many millennials now that have the income to get into the property arena, but they just don’t have the confidence. What? I don’t know where to start and when you have the media constantly saying you can’t do it, you’ve missed the boat. It’s not actually building the confidence in them to feel that, Hey, I can do something and if I can have a conversation with someone and they get sparked off and go, really, I can get into property. To me, you know, more people need to know. It’s more millennials need to know this. The number of people that I’ve just started their journey and the number of millennials, I’ve started their journey into the property market and this is helping set them up for life and especially where we are at the moment.

Um in the property market with the whole covert 19 I’ve been really going, come on, the market’s a buyer’s market, let’s roll up our sleeves. I’m really get you into the market. There are so many different methods to get. The property market doesn’t just have to be by your home in Sydney. There are so many untapped methods that a lot of these millennials aren’t aware of. So my book I guess is to help them, you know, feel more confident and also give us some tips of where to look and, and how to, you know, jump in.

Ben Handler:

That’s exciting. When’s that coming out?

Kitty Miles:

November this year. So I’m finishing writing away, but yeah, it should be a pre-Christmas release. So a good one for the Christmas.

Ben Handler:

Okay, nice. Well, I want to talk about females and specifically regarding the buyer’s agent space. I’m a firm believer just with my experience in this sector that I feel like the Buyer’s Agents space is more, I actually think it’s more tailored towards females. The real estate side on the sell-side. Never been a real estate agent, but I feel like that’s a very alpha male. Um, I think it’d be quite tough for women is my ex, just from my perspective. But I genuinely believe that it’s more, I think it’s more tailored to females is my honest opinion. So I love seeing people like you coming into this space, creating waves with passion, with vision, with purpose, with intent. I love it. So what’s been your experience jumping into this niche as a female, as an entrepreneur and then dealing with real estate agents running around? What have you noticed? I’m just curious.

Kitty Miles:

I do feel that generally speaking, the real estate industry is a very alpha male industry. Um, kudos to all the women in this industry that have battled, you know, to, um, find fighting for themselves. So yes, I agree with that. Uh, it has had its tough moments. It’s, um, but I’m on a mission. Um, I’m pretty unstoppable, so they can give me all they want and I’m not going to stop. Um, but I also second to that, I absolutely agree that I think the buyer’s agents space is so about understanding clients needs in more than just what property they want. It’s understanding their fears, understanding their motivations, having empathy for their particular situations and being, having uh, emotional and social intelligence, being able to read the cues from people. And I don’t want to gender stereotype, but I’m going to, I do feel naturally often women and more adept at the emotional aspect.

And I feel that in a buyer’s agent space that that fit is just so good. That’s not to say that men can’t bring something fantastic should the table. I feel the men that do really well in the buyer’s agent space are really in tune with skills such as empathy and have a high level of emotional intelligence. And I feel they bring that and that’s of great virtue as well. But generally speaking, I feel more women definitely should get into this space. It’s a great career for single moms. It’s a great career for moms that may have had a corporate role, but have taken time off to have children or that, and they want to get back to work. But once something that will fit with their lifestyles. There are so many reasons why this space just fits well for, for women that want a balanced life.

Ben Handler:

Yeah. I couldn’t agree more about it. Talking about the empathy and the, the EQ and I so agree with that. Like when we sit in front of clients as buyer’s agents, it’s, you’ve got to connect and really understand the the person and I think if you’re there if you’re just there for the sale and you’re there just to, um, you’re there at a surface level, you’re not going to cut through. And I feel like this is a particular role where you really need to understand human beings and like you said, if you feel like the client is not ready to buy, even after you’ve engaged with them, you have that level of intelligence and EQ and everything just actually call it out. And it’s interesting to see where this space is going to go with the buyer’s agent space. I do hope more women into this space.

Kitty Miles:

I do as well. Absolutely.

Ben Handler:

I want to just revert back a bit in terms of bringing in the business experience into this. I’m a, I mean I’m a, I started in the buyer’s agent space where you one would say, if you looked at my scorecard, you’d be like, man, this dude hasn’t, he may, he may not get, he may not get through this. I didn’t have sales experience. I hadn’t run a business and I hadn’t worked in a traditional real estate company. Okay. And so one might look at me and think, well, how’s this guy gonna succeed? He hadn’t worked out. He hasn’t worked as a buyer’s agent. He’s never worked in sales. You’ve never run a business. And what I’ve learned along my journey is that being a buyer’s agent, not just about buying property, it’s not just about buying property. You need to understand human beings. You need to have systems and processes. You need to learn how to work with clients by how to deliver that incredible experience where they refer to you. Um, how to scale if you want to scale there. There are so many elements to it. And I feel like from what I see and what I hear and just what that there’s not a whole, I think a greater appreciation for that in our sector. I just want to get your view.

Kitty Miles:

Yep. Spot on. Absolutely agree. Ben. I feel like we’re on the same page. I absolutely agree. When you really think about it, someone buying a property, whether it’s their first home, whether it’s an investment property, whether it’s their 10th property, they’re putting into that property purchase a huge amount of funds and when you put, when you actually connect the people with that, with the person, with that process and you think they’ve worked hard to make this money, they’ve sacrificed to do this. When you really think of what the lead up is to someone coming to you, looking to buy a property, there are so many emotions wrapped up and there are so many stories wrapped up behind all that. It’s not just about a property. As I say, it’s the fears, the motivations, the history that the experiences behind that and that you so need to build trust with your client.

And it’s not just the trust that you can buy them a property. It’s not that it’s the trust that you have their best interests at heart. It’s the trust that you can call them out if you, if you feel you need to, that you have that trust where the person will listen to your expertise and that you can go, I don’t think this is a winner. I don’t think we shouldn’t, you know, buy this. And it’s very much, it’s trusting to me it really boils down to trust and it’s relationship building and we can even take the property, you know, out of the equation it boils down to it’s a big-ticket purchase. Probably the most money people will spend in their life and they want to know that they can trust you. And I think that that’s the key to differentiating an average buyer’s agent, an average person in the real estate space and someone that is really good at what they do. It’s less about the experience, less about, you know, time in the industry. You know, you’re the, you’re the marker of that and it’s what you bring to that relationship.

Ben Handler:

We’ll probably have to do another session cause there’s so much to talk about before we wrap up. Where can people, where’s the best place for people to find you?

Kitty Miles:

People can find me either on LinkedIn, Kitty Parker, uh, my website, kittyandmiles.com.au. I also have Instagram, Kitty & Miles, uh, Facebook, Kitty & Miles, any of the above. But in all of these, uh, social media outlets, you’ll really get a feel for what I’m about. Cause it’s not just about the buyer’s agent and property stuff. I really give a lot of tips, advice, and very much me. I share a lot of me there.

Ben Handler:

Good on you. I mean, I’m inspired to see your journey. I always get inspired seeing single mothers get out there and kick ass. I love it. I love the energy you’re bringing to this sector and I’m going to be watching you.

Kitty Miles:

Thank, Ben. Thank you for having me today.

Ben Handler:

Appreciate, appreciate it. Okay. That was an awesome, awesome discussion. I’m, I’m super excited to see the future of our Kitty and Miles is going to do. I really feel like you should and really should be watching Kitty Parker and her business, because I do think she’s a definite standout in this space with what she brings to the table, I feel is very, very unique. So if you’re out there and you’re looking to buy property on a national level, you’re looking for a data nerd. You’re looking for incredible customer experience. Reach out to Kitty. See you next week.

Please watch the full episode here:

Helping Families Become Financially Free

Sateesh Palliyil has had a long history in property, having done his first subdivision nearly 20 years ago. Since then he has built up an impressive track record as an investor and developer having done a range of projects while working in the IT industry.

His first property deal in Australia was a land subdivision that he funded through a joint venture with his family and that started him on his path to financial freedom. However, he had been buying properties in India for many years.

“Before coming to Australia, I was in India and I used to work in Qatar. I used to go to India once a year for four weeks for annual leave and that’s when I began to purchase most of my properties. I was actively using buyers agents in all my transactions because in India there will be one or two buyers agents involved in every purchase.”

“Because they have experience in not just one area but have connections to other states or some other areas too”

After working for many years and investing part-time, Sateesh discovered that he was able to find better opportunities using his own skills.

“I was in IT for many years when I was doing all these projects. Then I found that if I was working as a full-time investor, I could see lots of deals out there by myself rather than depending on someone else.”

“I could also help lots of my friends and they’ve now done sub-divisions inspired by me. And they always call me and ask for advice and I always help them and they’ve all been successful.”

“So I thought, “Okay, I will make this a career and help people to become financially free just like me. I became financially free thanks to property when I was almost 29 years old and now I am 45 years old.”

As a buyers agent, Sateesh sees many investors making the same types of mistakes, so his goal is to open their eyes to different opportunities.

“Normally people go and buy a four-bedroom, two-bathroom, two-car garage house. That’s what the typical Indian buys as his first home. So when they look for an investment, they’ll do the same thing.”

“They don’t know there are many other options like sub-divisions, renovations, rooming house or duplexes.”

Despite starting his career as a buyers agent during COVID, Sateesh had a number of clients because of this reputation, which helped him get started.

“Luckily when I started my buyer’s agency, a few people already knew me so I got two clients straight away so that was a very good thing luckily.”

Sateesh was drawn to the idea of a career as a buyers agent as it was common in India.

“In India, in every transaction, there’s a buyer’s agent and then the selling agent, which makes things easy. So there’s always someone to represent you if you are buying a property.”

“There are no emotions or anything like that and that’s a very good model which I always expect here.

Sateesh found that BAI was incredibly helpful to him when he was starting out in the industry in what was a very tricky time.

“Ben’s got lots of incredible ideas that he shares in his webinars. I feel that every webinar has some kind of million-dollar idea in it.”

“He himself is a very successful buyer’s agent and he’s got lots of practical knowledge to share. That’s what I like about him. He’s not teaching you from books – he’s done it himself.”

Sateesh’s aim going forward is to help other people do what he’s done and put them in a position to be financially free.

“With the pandemic and recession threats around, it’s good to have insurance against unemployment. Having financial freedom means you don’t need to rely on unemployment payments that only just cover the bare necessities; you can continue to live a lifestyle that’s comfortable.”

“Just because you’ve achieved financial freedom doesn’t mean you stop working. You may want to increase your wealth, improve the comfort of your lifestyle or save for your children. But, should you or your partner lose their job, you are safe knowing your lifestyle is protected and you won’t need to make adjustments.”

“In the next five years, I want to help 100 families become financially free.”

What Your Study Doesn’t Equal What You Become

Buyer's Agent Kyrillos Mansour on why what you study doesn't equal what you become

Ben Handler:

Welcome to the Buyer’s Agent Institute Show. The purpose of the show is to bring awareness to buyer’s agents to bring awareness around the career opportunities that the buyer’s agent sector is providing people to bring awareness around the value that buyer’s agents providing people who need help on buying property. Our goal with the show is to strip back and dive into the remarkable journeys and stories of buyer’s agents who are paving the way forward in one of the fastest growing career sectors in real estate. Right now. Our guest today is Kyrillos Mansour. He goes by the acronym K, M. He’s based in New South Wales out in Western Sydney. He at a very young age, his father instilled values with him around how to best manage money, how to best utilize and save money to build wealth. He then studied optometry and after studying optometry, he started two businesses, not in that space, in hospitality and also in a very different area, which is a bit like perfume. He then also has had such a strong passion for property. He bought two properties before the age of 23, and he’s a young guy since then. He’s now running his new buyer’s agent business called first brick property buyer’s agency business. He’s buying property all across Australia. He’s a very passionate investor. So today I’d like to introduce and welcome, Mr. KM.

Kyrillos Mansour:

Thanks Ben. Appreciate it. That was a beautiful intro. Thank you so much.

Ben Handler:

Well, good to be here with you. I’ve seen you online. I’m seeing you’re pushing content. You’ve got a podcast, you’re a passionate investor, you’ve got nice spectacles on. I first want to just understand, we’ve got so many people in the Institute with such diverse backgrounds, professional backgrounds. I’ve never had someone else optometry. Yeah. How did you get into that?

Kyrillos Mansour:

So yeah, good question. Pretty much. I had no idea what I wanted to do when I was coming towards the end of school. I knew I wanted to get into business. You know, I love the business and why should I study a business degree? It’s going to take me four years to do a, everyone’s going to do a business degree. Or I could study optometry. I don’t know why my mate did optometry and I could do optometry with him. I’ll finish a bit quicker. And when I would a business degree and I fought, you know, optometry, it pays well, you know, it’s a nice income. And I thought you don’t really need a business degree to start business, but you need money most of the time. So forth. I’ll do a territory for a bit, get some money and go into business. So that’s how I pretty much got into optometry make did it and I want to tag along without to Jalong. And three years later became an optometrist and started businesses too long in Victoria. Johnny, Victoria. Yeah. So we started that in Geelong to study. Yeah. Living with my mate, it’s pretty good times. Yeah. So that’s how I got into optometry.

Ben Handler:

Good perspective. I like the fact that, you know, you record, I mean, you’re a young guy, you look pretty young. How old are you?

Kyrillos Mansour:

Just don’t to answer that.

Ben Handler:

Okay. So it’s great that you had perspective at a young age where you know, you don’t need to business in order to be good at business. Yeah, you’re right. Like you need to have obviously ideas you need to execute. You need money and it’s great that you saw the optometry space as a, as a vehicle to get you there quicker. Right?

Kyrillos Mansour:

Yeah, for sure. So yeah, like I said, that is something that I love business. You know, when I was in school, I was watching shark tank and you know, all these business programs and when I started business it just made sense. Like at school I didn’t really study. It just, it just made sense. But I realized you need money to have business to start a business and I thought it’s probably quicker making money as an optometrist and studying a business degree. So just jumped into that and then figure it out later.

Ben Handler:

Like, so many of the guests I have on the show, very entrepreneurial. You’ve obviously, you’ve got that entrepreneurial DNA. You started two other businesses. Yeah. Not including your buyer’s agent presenter you had so you had a perfume business. Yes. So was that online sale?

Kyrillos Mansour:

That was online. So I had that when I was at university. So during uni I had three jobs plus plus the business. Just, just for fun. I enjoyed it. I enjoyed working rather than just sitting at home with my mate doing nothing. So I had a couple of jobs, started the perfume and makeup business. Yeah, it was primarily online. We did one or two events where we had people come look at the products and whatnot. Just before my final exams I just sold it, sold it for a small profit. When you’re a uni student, a small profit, it seems like big money back then by the end. That was like my first real taste of business back back at university. Good, good. And then you start another business. Since then? I did. So when I was working as an optometrist full time I started the restaurant full time so it was a lot of work with a couple mates and then ran that for a couple years, then sold that one off to my mates a couple years later,

Ben Handler:

Two exits at a young age. And I bet you’re glad you’re not in a hospitality now.

Kyrillos Mansour:

It’s a it’s a tough, tough spot to be in for for anyone in hospitality at the moment, obviously. But I think hopefully I think a lot of people like to support local Aussie businesses and hopefully when we get to the other side of, of coronavirus and obvious people flood to their cafes and local restaurants and help out local business owners.

Ben Handler:

Whenever I go to a restaurant or a cafe, I always, I’m always analyzing just business and I don’t know a lot about that sector. I’ve never invested or run a business in that area. But I, it feels like just by looking at it, the return on time and the return on investment doesn’t make a lot of sense.

Kyrillos Mansour:

That’s correct. One of the reasons why we got out was because of that. And I mean I haven’t worked in too many industries, but I’ve worked in a few and it’s one of the harder industries. And to correct, like you say, for the return to a lot of time, it’s a lot of energy. It’s a lot of manpower and there’s not so much automation that you can get out of it. So you are physically there a lot of the time you’re trading your time for for not a lot of money. So which

Ben Handler:

Is which, which is challenging. So which moves you now into, well let’s, before we move into your buyer’s agent business, you bought two properties before 23, which is great.

Kyrillos Mansour:

Yeah.

Ben Handler:

What was the, what was the dry for the properties? Was, was there a specific reason why you wanted to buy them or you just thought it was good or,

Kyrillos Mansour:

No sir, well that’s actually a builder, but he had no influence on that actually, to be honest. Then when I was at university again I was just reading a lot of books about property business, you know, Warren buffet books, you know, books about anyone and anyone that was successful. Just trying to figure out how they did it. I came across a few property books that were quite out there. But gave me a perspective of, or you can actually make some money out of property. Started listening to podcasts, watching YouTube videos, anything I can get a hand on just to understand how property works. Realized you can become financially free just by buying some houses. This makes no sense, but kept looking into why does anyone else do this? Like it’s just so simple. And I just realized, Hey, I can stop working at a young age if I accumulate properties or whatnot.

Kyrillos Mansour:

As soon as I got my first paycheck after graduating as an optometrist, I went to the bank. He said I want a loan. And they kind of looked at me like, you don’t even have two paychecks. So I waited the second week, went back in, got a loan and looked into property and found what I wanted to buy. And that’s when the research in my spreadsheets or came to life because I just realized I enjoyed it. Yeah. So that was the first one. Second one was a couple years later, put out some equity and did it again.

Ben Handler:

So at least you had equity. So you obviously bought well.

Kyrillos Mansour:

Yeah, that’s right.

Kyrillos Mansour:

And wrote and hopefully wrote a good market. But let’s talk specifically more around your BA business. I mean, I’ve seen been watching you online, you’ve obviously got some good skill from your online perfume makeup business and obviously you’re pushing good content. Have you found is different about this buyer’s agent business compared to all the other stuff you’ve done at such a young age? In regards to business?

Kyrillos Mansour:

Yeah, for sure. I think in regards to business it’s, it’s something you in Australia it’s very small. It’s very niche. So there’s a lot of educating about the service rather than when we had the restaurant, I mean everyone knows what a restaurant is or where you had the perfume business. People knew what perfume was in makeup. There wasn’t so much explaining what the service or product was. It was more so just here’s the product, here’s the service, you like it, come buy it. Whereas with this business, with the buyer’s agency, it’s, you know, close friends of mine that have followed me from day one come up to me every second day and say, so what do you do? And, and you know, obviously pushing a lot of content about, you know, and educating what buyer’s agents do and how we can help help everyday Australians and other people to purchase property. I think that’s the biggest difference that I found initially is just educating people on what it is actually a buyer’s agent does. Cause as you would know, it’s not a very big industry at the moment in Australia. Quite small.

Ben Handler:

It’s a really good point you bring up and out of a lot of the people I’ve interviewed. No one really has specifically spoken about the education point because you’re right, it’s especially with you. You’ve run businesses before. People need to eat that is eat. People want to smell good. They spray perfume and not everyone up in the morning going, I’m going to buy something today or in two months I’m going to call a buyer’s agent. So there’s a, I think you’re right there. There’s a massive education piece that we’ve got to do which is needs to form part of our content strategy around education, around why people need a buyer’s agent, which I saw you did something yesterday. Six reasons, eight, eight reasons. Sorry, I saw that on Instagram. It’s great that you’ve identified that as an area that needs attention and more specifically, I wanted to also dive into you, I’ve seen you doing deals, you’re working with clients. How has been that client journey? Because obviously the online business is more product, not service. Your hospitality restaurant would have been very much customer service. This is obviously very high end service touch. How have you found that dynamic?

Kyrillos Mansour:

Pretty smooth to be honest. I think maybe because I just have a passion for it and like I enjoy talking about it and you know, when, when a client’s talking to me and they like, Oh, I’m so sorry. You know, do you have time for that mate? We can talk about property for the rest of the day. Your wife’s going to get you in trouble, not me. So it’s pretty smooth. And just I find when I explain everything to the customer or the client and really go through the process and, and show that I actually want to teach them that they see back in, they, they love top sober and they’re happy to go along cause they realize, you know, we know what we’re talking about and they appreciate that we’re teaching them but they still understand that just because we’re teaching them, it’s not as easy to do it.

Kyrillos Mansour:

So I found it pretty smooth to be honest. And you know, we are getting some clients and occupy clients. I’m very different to the investor clients. But both same fundamentals, you know, what we’re looking for and, and, and the education piece. But I find from all aspects, when you’re speaking to the client, if you’re educating them along the way, they, they just love it and they trust you and they realize, you know, their money’s going into safe hands and it’s going to become, it’s going to be much worth it, much more worthwhile for them in the longterm,

Ben Handler:

I believe. I know there’s a buyer’s agent within our community. I won’t name any names just so it’s not that it’s private, but I just thought I’d not mentioned it. They, they’re looking to read something. Someone in the buyer’s agency community, they’re looking to rent a property. They put me down as a reference. So I received a phone call from the property manager saying things are probably not just saying, just just interviewing this, this person, just getting some background information and make sure they’re okay. And what transpired in that conversation was the lady said to me, we were so impressed by call called mr X that my colleague who was there was really curious about the advocate services that he that he gives. He’s in Melbourne by the way. And so he, she said, my colleague just inherited money and was so curious, took a card from mr X to inquire more about his services. And then when you arrived here before the show, you then realized that the videographer who set this up lives near you and is potentially looking to buy. So where I’m going with this is there’s opportunity everywhere. There are people looking to buy property, create wealth everywhere around us. And so how have you found this whole notion of opportunity?

Kyrillos Mansour:

100% agree. There’s opportunity everywhere. Everyone wants to make money and everyone wants to have a financial future that’s secure and you know, so for some people, it’s freedom and not having to work again. So everyone’s looking to invest and everyone’s looking to, you know, generate wealth as we should be. But not a lot of people know how to get there and how to do it. So I find, you know, at the start it’s quite difficult, you know, getting your name out there and explaining. But like you said, you speak to a couple of people who a sudden you found someone that wants, wants to buy a property and you know, they speak to you. And if an opportunity is there, and even once that person’s done it and they’ve had a fantastic experience like luck my clients have and they told their mates, Evan, you know, slow spread, even though they may still their mate and it becomes like a nice big tree.

Kyrillos Mansour:

Of, of clients coming down and opportunities everywhere. So I find a hundred per cent agree with you. I think the opportunity is everywhere because anyone that you know has a job that has some solid income, is probably able to invest in some sort of capacity, might not be now it could be a bit later, but at least, you know, they’re learning how to where they need to be so they can start investing or, or buy their own property. Housing is very in demand quite often. So opportunities everywhere. And I find food, the Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn pages, like all our pages with all the educational content we’ve given out, people gravitate towards it cause they want to learn more and they want to learn more than they send you a message. Just to ho can you explain how do I get a better rate or how do I do this? And just one simple question. When they come back and they’re like, thank you so much for your help, you know, a bit of free help and they come back and can we do some work with you? So a hundred per cent agree opportunity literally is every everywhere.

Ben Handler:

And especially with the strategy, it seems like the approach you’re taking, which is giving out a lot of information, valuable information, just providing a lot of content. That’s what people want.

Ben Handler:

Yes. took a book, a page out of Gary on Facebook. Gary V is a big influence of mine. Yeah. I think the way he does it is very smart and, and very noble. And I, I like to think that do I want to do my run? My business is just, you know, give out information and try and help people make the right decisions and correct decisions. And I don’t know if you remember when we spoke a long time ago when we first started the journey. I told you I’ve had, I’ve met people that have made big mistakes cause of spruikers and whatnot. So that’s also why, you know, I love the education pieces. You know, if we can help someone not make a five, $600,000 mistake we’re setting them up in the right, in the right path for the future.

Ben Handler:

There’s a lot of spruikers when I got into the education space when I sold out of my company, I noticed that because we always personally talking to people at that time, and a lot of them had been sold into things, courses or even developments. And I heard a lot about people’s stories and it’s, it’s quite scary what goes on. And if even people were thinking that I was spruiking getting people into my program, I think I’m like, am I gonna be able to make money? Am I, I’m like, you know, like, it’s just, it’s a scary place out there. And as long as everyone’s operating with integrity, with good intention and just giving transparent information, that’s, that’s what’s important, right?

Kyrillos Mansour:

Yep.

Kyrillos Mansour:

Correct. So, and that’s what it’s all about. Like just that education and giving out information, like we don’t want people to look at us and think, you know, we’re just trying to sell them something or our best interest is really the client’s interest. And we do really, cause if the client succeeds, then they’re going to come back and then we’re going to make money and they’re going to make money and everyone’s happy and then they’re going to tell their friends and they’re going to bring more clients over to us. So it’s in the interest of ours or anybody’s agent I can assume to lead someone down the wrong path, you know, do something that’s not right. So I think that free information, the free education or the content, I mean, you can learn a lot if you just fill out pages. It’s just, there’s so much out there.

Ben Handler:

I love it. How did you come up with the name First Brick?

Kyrillos Mansour:

I was sitting in a garage of a couple of mates and I was 109 for these business and just names being thrown out everywhere. And it wasn’t mine, to be honest. I’m giving him a shout out. His name is Peter, cause he always wants to shout out. He said, what about First Brick? I said, Hey, this is a nice name. Well, we’ll try to think of something like just like the beginning a name that kind of resembled the beginning of a journey. Then First Brick, if he threw it out, nothing else made sense. It had to be first brick. And so it kind of stuck and everyone just kept yelling for his brakes. That’s the one. So it came up in a garage mate’s garage.

Ben Handler:

I love how things are ideated just very different, different environments. So what have you found you’ve been able to transfer from, you know, the hospitality, the makeup, perfumer, and just life experience? What have you found has been very transferable into this new business?

Kyrillos Mansour:

Yeah. it’s a good question. They are so different. The industries are so, so different. But I think one big common thing between all three is the service and the customer first approach. You know, when you run a restaurant, it’s just me, it’s all about the customer. If they’re not happy with the food or they’re not happy with anything, you take care of the customer. And it’s the same with the perfume and the makeup. The online, even though it’s online, you can’t see your customer because they’re behind the screen in their own home. They’re sending you a message and they’re putting a review. And when you’re in an online space, one bad review and you’re done. So the service and having the customer focus I think translated very easily into to the buyer’s agent world because like with the buyer’s agent, it’s all about the customer.

Ben Handler:

We have to, you know, whatever the customer needs, we build a plan for him, we find out a way that needs to get, what’s the end goal then how do we get there? So I think that skill has transferred over quite smoothly. And then other little things that you pick up, just how to run a business, you know, what to look out for, what to, what do in your day to day running. Definitely transferred into this. And I think a big work ethic from both businesses moved into this, which helps cause there’s a lot of work that obviously goes into them involved in every client. And even just running the day to day operations and business is a lot of work. Even having that work ethic beforehand from the first two businesses definitely translated into it.

Ben Handler:

So you started First Brick when you were 24 yes, yes. That’s actually the same age I was when I started Cohen Handler. It’s impressive that you’ve started other businesses you’ve exited out and you’re getting into this space. I think more so because you’re entrepreneurial, you’re passionate about property and I, there’s a lot of transferable skills. I’m sure that you, which is evident from what you’ve just shared, bringing to the table. And it’s also exciting to see where this space is going to go. The buyer’s agent space, as you know, and as you were saying earlier, as you have, we have to educate people because it’s so niche, but it’s because it’s so niche. It’s also very opportunistic. But it’s, it’s going to grow a lot and it’s just interesting to see where it’s going to go. I mean, you’re obviously quite fresh in this space. What’s been some stuff that you’ve observed around this industry? Could it be anything? I’m just curious to know from your point of view.

Kyrillos Mansour:

Probably the first thing like we’ve kind of touched on is that no one knows what it is or not. A lot of people don’t know what it is. Why is that? I just don’t think it’s very common in Australia at the moment. Like, you know, the numbers probably better than me how many buyer’s agents there are

Ben Handler:

But, but why do you like, I’m just curious to get your point of view that, why do you think it’s, it’s been so there’s been so much weight on the sell-side with obvious representation from the selling agent to the vendor versus buyer’s agent to a buyer.

Kyrillos Mansour:

Well, I think, I personally think so. You know, Aussies, Australians, we love to talk property. And I had the barbecues on the weekend or when we were mates, you know, having to be, or whatever it is. There’s someone’s talking about property. And I think because we love it so much and we live in it, we think we’re all experts at it and we can all do it. And just, you know, Bob up the road board place and made some money off her so, you know, you learn from him and he might be doing it or he just might be riding a boom at the end of a wave or something. And I, I think because our intrinsic values are to talk about property I think it’s slower on the buying side because everyone wants to do it and everyone wants to buy themselves and wants to invest, which is fantastic. No issue with that. But I think when it comes to the selling, we are a bit more hesitant to sell our own place or to sell the products that we always look for an expert to sell it. So I think that might be a big part of why it’s not so common here. I know like in the US it’s very, very common to use a buyer’s agent. It might be different. They maybe they don’t care about, they don’t want to talk about property or their everyday life like we do.

Kyrillos Mansour:

Yeah. Not interesting observation. I mean, yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s always me like, cause when I started and I felt like no one knew what advisor at all. And so just explaining the value proposition and just giving some insight as to why I thought it was necessary. It just looked like you’re staring at a brick wall. It’s, it’s sometimes, so it was challenging, but it’s, it’s definitely improving. And I, I, I believe it’s, it’s gonna, it’s gonna change a lot over that for the best, for the next, you know, two to three, four years.

Ben Handler:

You were the pioneer I guess in, in your course definitely helps. Bring, bring the buyer’s agents into more light and, you know, get more awareness around it, which I think is a fantastic, fantastic thing. Evan. I’ve in the community between, between the buyer’s agents. It’s not this, I haven’t personally seen like such competition between them small, how can I help you? Didn’t like, you know, some of the new guys that are starting out, I mean I’m new but some of the newer guys are messaging me, Hey can you help me with this? For sure. Like happy to help and what do you need them? And the other day, you know, I see someone needs help with a, with a client, they’ve passed it on someone else. Like no issues, no huge like rivalries or anything like that. I think everyone’s happy to, to help each other cause we can see the potential space growing to like a massive, massive scale, which is, which is something really cool.

Ben Handler:

Yeah. And that’s it. Thank you. It’s a good observation as well. I think, you know, the community is a big part. Just talk about helping and serving and sharing information and the camera. It all comes back for the best and having more of an abundance mindset mentality as opposed to a scarcity which you’ve clearly, you’ve clearly got the abundance. What’s your podcast called, by the way?

Kyrillos Mansour:

So it’s got the First Brick Property Podcast, so it didn’t, we fought skateboard and that was pretty, pretty similar. So first brick property podcast even the pages First Brick Property Buyers’ agency on every social platform you can think of.

Ben Handler:

Yeah. Awesome. Oh KM. It was good to chat. Thank you for having me. It was a, it’s inspiring to hear your story. You’ve started multiple businesses in different sectors industries and you are obviously leading the way now I think in this new space because you’re actually, you’re, you’re following your passion. So by leading, I’m not saying you need to have been here for 10 years, but everyone’s a leader. We’ve even got leaders without titles. On each side of this board is every single person is a leader. And the fact that you’re now pursuing your passion, you’ve bought properties, you’ve run businesses, you’ve sold businesses. I believe you’re leaving the Waymade. So I appreciate you being here. Thank you for having me. Appreciate it. Some. Thank you. So check out KM. He’s the man on social media. Check him out. Check out his podcast. He gives out a lot of information. He gives that a lot of his time and that’s what you want. And so if you’re listening here, check him out. He’s websites on the screen. Check out the podcast across all social platforms. Loves property based in Sydney, buying property across many different States. Hope you enjoy today. See you next week.

Please watch the full episode here: